Rasa not so sayang?

fyi…”rasa sayange”–a maluku folk song–was “introduced” by a number of senior indonesian navy officers to a larger audience in the western part of indonesia in late 50s. those seamen, in the old days, were practically the only ones with unlimited access to the eastern part of the country. they were the ones who vigorously nurtured the idea of indonesia as one united republic, by among other things, introducing a number of folk songs and dances from the east in the hope that all indonesians–from sabang to merauke, as they said–would be, culturally, familiar with each other.
like any other folk songs, of course it was difficult to identify the composer of “rasa sayange”. this, of course, does not necessarily mean that it belongs to “anybody” even if this “anybody” falls into the category of “saudara serumpun”…

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Malaysia lageee…. cape deh dengerin berita dari negara ini ….

Bagaimana bisa kita hormati kalau kelakuan kayak “maling” ….

Untuk orang Indonesia, tolong jangan berkunjung ke negara ini…. masih banyak negara lain yang lebih menarik dari Malaysia …. Gw sendiri udah pernah ke KL, sumpah deh gw gak bakalan lagi berkunjung ke negara “Katro” kayak gini ….

Kalau anda tetap berkunjung kesini berarti anda ikut melestarikan kebudayaan maling sesuai dengan motto MTB ” Visit Malingsia 2007, Truly Maling in Asia …” Hahahaha…..

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Bapak, Permisi pakai story dalam blog saya.

Wah! kalo pemintaan dari Mas Rocky pasti bisa!

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Terima Kasih, bro!
All this while, I thought Rasa Sayang eh was a Singapore song. Like Di Tanjung Katong airnye biru …

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Indonesia harus bertindak! nggak cukup dong dengan berkeluh kesah doang … Malaysia memang selangkah lebih maju dalam mengeksplorasi dan mempromosikan aset bangsa mereka – sorry, maksudnya aset bangsa kita – seharusnya Indonesia protes resmi. Rasa Sayang dari Hongkong ?! pleaseee ……

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malaysia… cobalah cari esensi budayamu apa… exploit the essence of your own culture gitu… jangan sampai nanti ada yang ngeledek.. “malaysian culture? what culture?”

get my point, bro?

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dasar Kutu Kupret… gak punya budaya.. jangan2 gak puya kemaluan..

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We really shouldn’t blame malaysia for stealing our traditional song, considering their people can’t even write or compose any decent song whatsoever. So pathetic.

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wah, orang malaysia emang nyebelin!!! semua dicolongin. bukti kalo bangsa mereka sama sekali nggak kreatif dan berbudaya. cuma untuk bikin jingle iklan aja, mereka cari-cari pengarang dari indonesia. bahkan sinetron di tv mereka juga bikinan script writer indonesia. its true! terusnya mereka ngaku-ngaku kalo itu buatan mereka. bah! bahkan suku bangsa mereka aja asalnya dari sumatera. mereka nggak punya penduduk asli kayak kita.
jadi, buat temen-temen sesama indonesia… ayo dong tunjukin nasionalisme kita dengan lebih INDONESIA.

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I think the main problems are … lack in creative and ethics … This is a big ashame if formal institution like Malaysia Tourism Board (MTB) did it …..

If they smart, MTB can make a contest or something, spend the money (they have much money to do this), showcase the Malay rock or maybe introduce Iban songs any day.

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tulisan idiot-indon gonjol macam sapi ..

Kalau anda tetap berkunjung kesini berarti anda ikut melestarikan kebudayaan maling sesuai dengan motto MTB ” Visit Malingsia 2007, Truly Maling in Asia …” Hahahaha…..

…………..
hahahaha yang jadi maling indon ni le .. datang malaysia jadi pencopet kasi pecah rumah

indon .. “truly maling “

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yudas

apa kamu mau serang malaysia … pakai apa buluh runcing hahaha

mau lepas selat melaka naik apa … rakit pisang ..kena ombak kamu semua lemas .. dasar bangsa goblok selalu cari isu remeh , senjata kamu semua sudah usang lagi mau serang kami .. baik bagi rakyat supaya tak kebuluran …

apa kalau kamu mau serang kamu ingat kami diam diri , cobalah le …

sapa mau serumpun dengan bangsa sakai …

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pasal SO7, radja , samson pun bising

aku dan kawan-kawan aku minat metallica , green day , gnr .. amerika tak bising pun

eleh indon .. itu aje dia da selain tu kepapaan , kebuluran aje

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shit, dunno what those myASSians are talking about.

you’re using AMBONESE FOLKLORE SONG as your “truly asia” campaign. You guys from myASSia studied geography in your elementary school ey? AMBONESE or ppl from MALUKU is Indonesia’s territory. so AMBONESE FOLKLORE SONGS are belong to INDONESIA. NOT myASSia.

quote from my blog

“bangsa yang besar adalah bangsa yang menghargai budaya sendiri dan budaya orang lain” – “big country is a country that respect their own culture, as well as other countries’ culture”

well yes now think bout that.

respect is the most expensive thing a? and malaysians (myASSians) doesnt seem to have that. poooor thing for such a ‘big’ country. did i say big? yeah right bigggg. :p

oh yeah, english please.

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Dear Kamarul,

A Malay in Malaysia is defined as: (1) a person who is a Muslim of the Sunni branch of Islam of the Shafie mazhah (school) of thought, (2) having both or one of the parents as Malays, (3) habitually living according to Malay culture and customs including having Malay as a mother tongue, and (4) parents or ancestors from any part of Malay world but having lived in Malaysia on or before Malaysia day.

Refer to above definition, what do you mean as Malay culture ? It is still unclear for me ….

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Hwahahahahaha..Sorry..I can’t stop laughing. Malay language is so hilarious. No wonder they adore and use our language there.Hahahaha.. Hey goblok gonjol, you made my day with your uneducated language.

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PERANG SAJA….KAN LAGI TREND!…

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Jangan gadoh! Apa la.. govt nak alihkan perhatian rakyat dia dengan nasionalism la.. Malaysia pon sama, everytime ada big issues internally, we start to shoot to singapore. Furthermore, kan heritagenya sama both countries, kalau tidak masakan org KL macam org gila pergi Bandung shopping sampai senget kapalterbang. The problem now lies with Malaysia Tourism Board sbb didnt check the facts carefully first. Idiots. Regarding the TKI yg banyak buat onar di Malaysia, what can you expect? From 150 mil orang, mestilah percentage yg jahat ada n jadi besar no dia ..

Korang gila nak perang… 26 juta ngan 150 juta… dahla sket, cina ngan inda sure lari dulu, yg melayu takde duit dok nganga.. yg org UMNO ade kat australia dah… bodoh ape korang

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Dear kamarul,
i don’t know what level of education you have, but obviously cigarettes can’t be analogied with batik in this case. Batik is a culture, while cigarette is NOT. And yes we are all aware of the crisis our country is facing, but at least we don’t need to steal anything from other countries. There are enough problems already and the last thing we need is a neighbour claiming our traditional cultures are theirs. The song “Rasa Sayange” origins from Indonesia (the language says it all) but Malaysia obliviously used it as a campaign to promote their country and that’s what started this conflict (again). They could at least mention the real origin of the song. But what’s their response to it when it’s brought up to the media? They talk all this shitshat about other things irrelevant from the real case. Stealing that you mention by uneducated Indonesians is unquestionably illegal and intolerable, but how about stealing other country’s culture by “royalties” and a nationwide government? Can you understand that analogy?

But thanks for explaining that batik pattern difference, i hope that’s true. I’m just hoping that we legalize kebaya as our national costume real soon before “someone” steals it again.

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my last comment is for kamarul and so much for your stupid comments.

rasa sayang song is belong to indonesia.

and its a shame for myASSians to use that song.

“bangsa yang besar adalah bangsa yang menghargai budaya sendiri dan budaya orang lain” – “big country is a country that respect their own culture, as well as other countries’ culture”

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theres no need to lengthen the debate whos who, just prove it that its urs, thats all that matters. from what i know there is NOBODY can challenge me by giving out the fact that an INDONESIAN guy

Pengerusi Majlis Hak Cipta Indonesia, Enteng Tanamal, berkata tindakan untuk menyaman Malaysia mungkin tidak akan berjaya kerana tidak ada siapa tahu siapa pencipta lagu itu.
“Bagaimana nak saman Malaysia jika tidak ada siapa yang tahu siapa pencipta lagu itu? Jadi biarlah Malaysia menggunakan lagu itu sebagai lagu tema pelancongan mereka,” katanya. kenyataan ini sudah cukup jelas bahawa lagu ini bukan kepunyaan indonesia

so uguys can go upto anything to say whatsoever u like..the fact that u can’t prove it urs say it all…until somebody say that this INDONESIAN guy is a total moron that i would take it seriously onto further debate whether it is really indonesian but till then the song belongs to nusantara, no country have ever been claimed that it is theirs

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@kamarul:

lol. what an answer I have already predicted by those prick malaysians.

all you know is just defending your stupid country, without knowing whether they are right or wrong.

as I said, u have no idea what is AMBONESE people, ambonese culture, ambonese languange, and ambonese folk song.

when did myASSia exist?

when did Indonesia exist?

when did AMBONESE culture, songs, language exist?

lol

how bout that? plagiarists?

just admit that Indonesian’s culture is far richer than malaysian’s, and malayshit just too jealous to us.

now youre talking about timor leste. lol. see. u keep proving that you are a stupid poofter in every posts. timor leste did not have army, they are backed by Australian’s army. now you think, studge.

my Gosh.

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yeah yeah yeah accusing, with all kind of bad words, dats all u can do, none less!!! just one thing u couldnt do, to prove that the Indonesian copyright guy is wrong…and yeah australian army is the ones fighting indonesian army under the UN banner…i don’t know since when there was a UN resolution sending an army to counterattack indonesian army…i thunk ur still dreaming how NATO droved out those Serbians.

theres no need to repeat any of ur non sensible facts with addition of” i don’t know what culture that teaches u those bad words???” just admitlah u lost timor leste and u cannot prove that this song is urs….theres no need to mumbles around though

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its not mine, did i say it’s mine?it belongs to AMBONESE ppl, and ambon is in Indonesia territory. thats the fact. lol.

and yes, i admit that indonesia has lost its timor leste, coz its just a useless territory (unlike aceh). no wonder indonesian government did not put as much effort to block timor leste to leave indonesia as they did on Aceh.

precisely, youre the one who mumbles by talk about jewish, barbarians and all those crappy thing. remember?

haha.

robber!

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??? who dare to say the turth…sorry to say but um i don’t get any dat u said

myASSia: its not mine, did i say it’s mine?it belongs to AMBONESE ppl, and ambon is in Indonesia territory. thats the fact.

Fact??? wat is the fact??? was it being registered by ur copyright ppl that it is indonesian??? if it was so, why the head of that council contradicted with u??? who is actually in charge of that agency, u or him??? is he working for u???

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I want to comment on kamarul question…

The fact that we don’t know who is the first writer of the song does not mean that anybody can use it without permission or claim that it is theirs.

Many of world’s songs that the writer is unknown, especially old song or traditional song. The right of this songs belongs to community.

In indonesia, we recognize that this song comes from Ambon (not from malay ethnic or javanese or bataknese) although we don’t know the writer. We acknowledge the people/community which it belongs to…

And it is not about royalty, i believe most indonesian will be satisfied if it is acknowledged as indonesian/ambon song…

thank you

thank you

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well i wanted to reemphasized on sweet wednesday’s comments:
The fact that we don’t know who is the first writer of the song does not mean that anybody can use it without permission or claim that it is theirs.
Many of world’s songs that the writer is unknown, especially old song or traditional song. The right of this songs belongs to community.

now let us look upon it again, the first statement is “the fact we don’t who is the first writer” which means the exact particular owner of this song is unknown. secondly “does not mean that anybody can use it without permission”, then logically if we do not know the owner of the song, then from whom should we seek the permission??.

third “The right of this songs belongs to community.” and “In indonesia, we recognize that this song comes from Ambon” so clearly she literate the community that owns the song is in Ambon, now i would like to emphasize that it is not now, it is at the time the song was first introduced.
Then in brackets she said “(not from malay ethnic or javanese or bataknese)” which she stressed upon that it is not belong to any ethnic, making it more of Ambon (a place) rather than ethnic.

well logically we can say the owner of this song belong to people who was at Ambon at the time the song was introduced. now the people there could be of any ethnic background, and i believed this happened long2 time ago. Humans population do migrated from places to places over years and those people at Ambon at that time might have been spread to the whole world.

now lets assumed that logically people those days migarated to places near to them due to the impoverished transport system at that time. so i would say the nusantara is the best scope of region that can be reached within the context.

lastly it is concluded that its a song of nusantara becoz the ancestral heritage of it had spread beyond geographical boundaries. so it is not a song a nation, it is a song of the region, it is song of nusantara, and everybody in nusantara has the right to access it. Claiming that this entity as a nation’s right is a denial toward rights of other people from other countries…

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STEALING in this context is defined as an act to take something from a person, shop/store etc who owns it, without permisssion and without intending to return it or pay for it. now it looks like im gonna give something like an english lesson.

in order for us to prove that an act of stealing really occurred, we must fulfill the definition of stealing for that matter. first is “an act to take something from a person” which in this case we have to prove that this act of taking something really happened. now malaysia said this song is not indonesian becoz indonesia cannot prove that it is their, so it belongs to nusantara becoz of its ancestral heritage and i don’t recall malaysia saying that this song belong to us, all the while we are saying we have the right to use this song as nusantaran. indonesia in otherway claimed that this song belongs to them although they could not prove that it is their. so, the one performing the first rule of stealing by taking something which is not their is INDONESIA.

secondly, those who said it was taken away from must prove that the song is actually their. for this matter even the president of ur copyright thing cannot prove it, so the statement that says it is indonesian is just something crappy that uguys created without any backing proofs. malaysia on the other hand said that this song belong s to nusantara and based on facts and logical jurisdiction, it can be easily proved, i bet in any court of justice in the world.

thirdly, “without permisssion and without intending to return it or pay for it”, for this matter i questioned uguys, as if it is really urs, the writer of this song is unknown, so who would i pay for it, or return it or ask permission from. if u would say from indonesia, it cannot be becoz the owner of this song is logically people who were at Ambon at the time it was introduced. now these people might have migrated to other part of nusantara, there might not stayed until now within the geographical boundaries of indonesia. plus one more jackpot proving that this song is more of nusantara rather than indonesian.

i would say from the above criteria, indonesia has become more appropriate to fulfill most of the criteria needed to classify it stealing the song from nusantara as if the claimed that the song belong to indonesia and not nusantara. malaysia for the meanwhile did not even fulfill a single criteria as the one stealing….

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im giving two thumbs up for few comments left lately from other threads. first to opah on now rasa some sayang. u know shes been making the point why im saying ur social policy that panca whatsoever is failing in its first place. it tries to assimilate the difference race and religions. for me technically it is dangerous becoz u does not appreciate the identity of each race and religion

in malaysia the social system is a bit safer, trying to integrate those races and religions, not assimilate. in any nation there should be a problem including malaysia but i think this is rather a better a good platform rather than those in indonesia

second to kemsey and long john on Malaysian Tourism Minister on Rasa Sayang: saying that how come the malay language which is the minority in indonesia was chosen to be the indonesian language and not those javanese language which is the majority. what a shame choosing a minority language to be become ur national identity over those javanese and the other craps haha

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my point is in malaysia, we got malays that originated from part of indonesia eg minang, javanese, bugis and so on along with other ethnics. in indonesia also u uguys got this, javanese, malays, ambonese and so on. now the respective ethnics nowadays does not confined to a geographical boundaries.

thats why i ask uguys to prove to me factually, based on law that this song belong to indonesia which i means there is legal binding that this song is really urs. the problem is u cannot prove it and that is what im questioning about when uguys are claiming it. if let say uguys can prove it that it is urs, so be it, nobody gonna challenge that.

when nobody cannot claim that this song is their, so this song is better off belong to the region, let everybody use it, let everybody make it as their culture and theres no need to say somebody stealing it from you even though u cannot prove it is urs. u get what i mean??? of course this song originated from maluku, im not questioning it but when u say it belongs to indonesia and no other country can use it commercially then im asking a just question, whether u got any legal binding by saying those.

regarding migrated population, nobody can question their right to practice what they believes in, their custom, their heritage and their culture. when u say it belongs to indonesia and nobody cannot use it, what about these migrated populations’ right??? u have been denying their basic right of a human being, which is totally wrong. look at china, it got migrated population in alot of nations in the world even in the pacific, america, asia and so on. have u heard any conflict involving china restricting other nations from practising their culture, the hell no. becoz they are not so stupid like uguys that donot understand that cultures go whereever the population. not to mention other races too

just cut the crap already, u cannot prove it is urs and please donot deny other people’ right to their own culture.

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*Sigh*
Malaysians just never learn. Must be a severe case of Amnesia. Didn’t I just give you all the run-down on the History of Malaysia? Or rather, the origins of the Malays? Unspun please show them the way.

All self-claimed“true-blood” keris-wielding Malays are ex-Indonesians. As such, all crafts and songs, legends and stories originate from Indonesia. Together, they form the “Rumpun Melayu”. Unfortunately this Rumpun Melayu does not stop at Indonesia. It extends all the way up till Cambodia, Vietnam, Thailand right up until Easter Island. The so-called “scientific” name is Malayo-Polynesian. (yes that is the correct spelling) It was rejected in 1870’s because of lack of evidence in classifying the Malays as a race. Hence the Linguistic constipated definition.

In fact 75% of self-claimed True-Blood Malays are no more than ex-Javanese. The rest, are Bugis (Sulawesi), and the Sumatrans. Even the “Great Malaccan Empire” was a Sumatran migrant.

Take the great “founder” of Modern Malaysia. The “Legendary” Parameswara. Who was he? Our “his-story” textbooks tell us that he was a Prince from Palembang who founded the great Malacca Empire. Apparently a small mousedeer kicked his dog’s ass so hard that he said that this was a good place to start a Kingdom.

Number ONE) I’ve got very bad news for you. A prominent NUS Professor is about to publish a 600+ page TEXTBOOK, which in a nutshell summarizes that

“MALACCA was INSIGNIFICANT”

I’ve already read it. The facts clearly point in that direction. (E-mail me, and I will get you autographed copies of it when the book goes to print at the end of Oct)

Number TWO) Don’t’ you think the tiny ass-kicking mousedeer part is a bit far fetched? Mind you, this is in YOUR CHILDRENS” TEXTBOOKS!!!! Do you want them to be fed that kind of CRAP?

Number THREE) Here’s the REAL Story. Parameswara was the Prince of the Majapahit Empire. There was a Death Warrant on his head decreed by HIS OWN FATHER for wanting to usurp the Throne. He ran. He ran to Singapore. After a week, he KILLED THE SINGAPORE chieftain. (Its beautifully played out in a multimedia presentation in The History Museum of Singapore. I think I was the only one in the room, who was proudly clapping when I saw this) (even the Pasir Salak, Perak Museum confirms this with a marrionette) Since Singapore was under Thai rule at that point, The Siamese King issued Parameswara’s second Death Warrant. He ran to a place called “Biawak Busuk” at the mouth of the Muar River. As the Siamese were catching up with him, he ran away again. This time, to Malacca. By then, since his only source of income was Piracy by his Bugis followers, (who plied the Straits of Malacca), the Achenese issued Parameswara’s THIRD Death Warrant for Piracy of their ships.

A runaway Hindu Prince called Parameswara with 3 death warrants on his head. That’s the founder of Modern Malaysia. Now why weren’t we told of this? Coz it’s embarrassing! That’s why! Wanna hear what else has been hidden? I’m merely scratching the surface!

I was researching for any trace of the “Great Malaccan Empire” and sad to say, I did not find one shred of evidence at all! To visit “Historic Malacca” you see the Portugese Fort, and the Red Dutch buildings. You also see a “re-creation” of a big building they call the Palace. I want solid evidence of the “Great Malaccan Empire”. Not the “Great Portugese Empire”, or the “Great Dutch Empire”.

The Malaccan Sultanate existed. Don’t get me wrong, but it was not THE Great Empire which one is falsely led to believe. It was more akin to a roadside canteen selling the-tarik.

We now ask ourselves, what all this “Ketuanan Melayu” is all about. Transalated, it means the “Lordship of the Malays”. Let us all ask who the Malays have “Lordship” over? And is how they celebrate this “lordship” by frantically waving a keris (crooked knife) at public meetings on national tv like a Drunken Wiccan Ritual on steroids? Let’s all wait until the Malays release the “official” press release on whom exactly the Malays have lordship over.

Until then, let’s all debate on the other fact, which is that Rais Yatim specifically stated that the Wayang Kulit is of Hindu origin. Not just that, the design are all clearly Siamese, to reflect the other northern migrants’ origins.

Final word, Bengawan Solo is so much nicer than “Taste of Love” (rasa saying).
And Anggun’s English Albums are far superior to Malaysia’s backward-driven-cheap-copies of crap metal of the 70’s. Not worth it. Forget it. The fact is, Malaysia will always be a B-grade copycat. And to think that the Foreign Minister made an ass of himself on Hard Talk on the BBC just not too long ago. Worse, he openly admits to copying others…..

Culturally speaking, Malaysia and Indonesia are like dissected twins. Maybe Indonesia wants to take over their “rightful claim” on Malaysia like in the 1960’s? So they are now spawning ideas about all that I’ve written so far….be warned. Don’t say I didn’t tell you.

Truly Asia Boleh

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these are few updates on this matter: the malaysian cultural minister is ready to debate this matter based on law as the common ground saying to counterattack any indonesian argument saying that this song is their. he said that he had the proof based on extensive research on that matter. he said that the nusantaran peoples songs have been existed since sri wijaya period aledy that was from 6 to 13 centuries and that this culture had spread to the whole nusantara region and that NO NATION can claim that this song is their.

i would say if any legal action will be ever taken by the indonesian government against the malaysian, that we must reciprocate by taking appropriate legal action against the copycats songs of malaysian singer P Ramlee such as Hujan di Tengah Hari, Kata Dari Kalbu, Apabila Kau Tersenyum, Azizah, Tjik Mamat (Che Mamat) and Jalei-Jalei ( Yale-Yale song which was taken from the Berdosa Movie 1951). these songs as he said in those days do not have copyrights due to at that time we believe that the songs must be allowed to be shared to find common ground by neighboring countries. these songs were copies made by indonesian singers such as Sjaugi (Shaugi), Hasnah Tahar and Rien in the early 1980-an

however, because we have these records available with overwhelming proofs making any LEGAL action against the indonesian government is imminent, easily to be taken and the prospects of gaining alot is really significant. furthermore, it will give a nightmare backlash against the indonesian music industries.

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thanks mike for the informative facts…all this while ive been saying that the culture goes wherever the people goes. u can call me whatever u like, like i care but u just prove that we have migrants population all over the countries and that from these migrants population our cultures originated. u said they are ex-indonesian, i would say indonesia didnt even existed at that time. if u say they are ex-javanese, ex-bugis, ex-minang, ex-siamese, then it cannot be. the ethnic of a person can never change whether he got to other places right???

so now these javanese, bugis, siamese and so on stayed in malaysia. do they have the right to practice their culture based on their ancestral heritage??? if u said NO then u are denying the basic right of a human being to practice what the believes and their culture. so for me they have the bloody right to practice batik, those rasa sayang, wayang kulit, keris etc. now talking about keris somemore, wake uplah, u should do another research on this. u are making a connection between this keris and the ketuanan melayu concept.

now let me tell u though, this ketuanan melayu crap is created by those UMNO people which means its a political concept. u go and do a survey on malaysian and ask them whether it is a concept for our nation. the hell NO, its political, they do this to boost the support from the far-right voters. not to mention that crap NEP things, u go and ask the malaysian, how many of them agrees on it???

theres no need to do those crappy things, accusing somemore, u go and read my post above, does malaysia did fulfill the basic definition of stealing???? and who else fits better??? now for what u said about the wayang kulit and i really think u should do less research but think more. the answers are in ur statement but i bet u never think about it, do ya??? i would say YES its storyline is based on history but it is not really factual, its depiction. now i myself at the first place donot understand this coz im not so that art enthusiasts but u know its as simple as ABC. the storyline is a depiction of how a hindu prince from majapahit (parameswara) as Ramayana came to malacca, converted to Islam and his making his state as the center of Islamic spread, its just the characters that they emphasized on, u need to understand whats behind it really.

now this ministers, do u think i like them the most??? the hell NO, this BN government should go down by any means, but why im saying like this is that in this matter they are making a good point. WHEN URE ACCUSING SOMEONE OF STEALING UR THINGS, U SHOULD PROVE THAT IT IS URS. im asking my indonesian counterpart who can prove that what the Indonesian copyright guy said is wrong, NONE of them prove it. im not that smart eh really and i dont really knows all the facts that u researched on but what im doing is that if they really think its their, then they should stand for it and prove it. NONE of them prove it, and what do ya expect me to say???

im really sure that u need to think alot more, less research. ur statements are like contradicting each other. First u mentioned “malaysian theft” by which u didnt prove any, u just skirted around the facts without making any points on stealing itself. then with all the baseless accusations, u end up saying “Culturally speaking, Malaysia and Indonesia are like dissected twins.” what a heck and what a crap things to say. first u said we are theft then u said both of us are twins. PLEASE thinklah, what twins have belong to both of them, none can claim that it belong to one person and none can say that the other cannot have it. the latter says it all, uve been very confusing at the very beginning but hey i couldnt agree more with u on ur last point. what a mess….

by the way what are u??? bristish?? americans??? australian??? do tell me coz let me tell the others too what ur forefather or ur people did to other people. u are sure a very very bad “BATU API” for God’s sake. i read ur comments before even ur understanding on Islam itself is totally WRONG and hey im really sure u need to think more and less research….

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I’m a Malaysian, my parents are Chinese-Indian (my dad), and Javanese (my mom). My grandparents were immigrants, and as our family history goes, they were star-crossed lovers in true “Antara Dua Darjat” style, and had traversed the ocean to the shores of Peninsula so they could get married, bla bla bla.
I’m not embarassed of that story – in fact it’s a part of my identity and I’m proud of it. I used to travel to Jakarta and Medan to visit relatives and love my time there as well.
I guess what I’m trying to say is that there are also Malaysians who have roots in both countries and love both and watching the childish put-downs of one country from another is just sad.
(btw I don’t see “Indon” as a derogatory term, and it’s definitely not valid if only one group of people with self-declared superiority issues make it such.)
I think both countries have a lot of weaknesses. And both countries have a lot of wonderful things about them. And many of which are alike. I wish we’d just stop this argument – which is hard when the higher-ups of the countries decide to make it their own crusade for votes.
I hate it when Malaysians blame foreigners for every single problem in this country. As if Malaysians don’t do anything wrong at all. And if we really wanted to reduce the illegal immigrant labor issue – think about it – what about the thousands of Malay penggangurs on a free education ride from the government (half the time with merely average academic qualifications compared to private scholars chosen on merit not race) who are too arrogant to work small jobs and waiting for the next pay off? We’ve got Cambodians and Thais and the rest of the region working in restaurants, stores and construction sites. They found a way to make a living, no matter how humble the job is – it’s a way to keep their families afloat. Malaysians just stick their noses in the air and think these “buruh” level jobs are below them. So who’s going to do these jobs?
If all the immigrants left one day – Malaysians would be left with some major s*** in their hands. And then there will be some policy drawn up by some elected special committee wih a fancy name and big acronym to properly regulate a set of rules to allow foreign labor to do the jobs that are too menial for citizens of Bolehland.
I wish Rasa Sayang could be shared, instead of fought over. And the music industry debate should just stop because it’s turning into an ego war also.
I love Malaysia and I love Indonesia. I still refuse to indicate my ethnicity in every single Malaysian document (because we need to know who to give the discounts and hand outs to so much) because I think it doesn’t matter. I love the fact that so many beautiful cultures and traditions and art come from the different branches of my family tree that I can trace all over the world.
So let’s just leave the trivial childish arguments to the people who do it best – our politicians – and rise above them as people who can actually learn from each other, and SHARE.

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wow..now i realized the debate had gone way too outstretched… i would like to bring it to the subject again.

Based on these few things we discussed:
1. every person has the right to practice their culture, anywhere they go including those malays, siamese, javanese, ambonese, bugis and so on in malaysia
2. the fact that the indonesian copyright head himself could not prove that the song is indonesian, so the malaysian MTB act of using the song commercially cannot be regards as stealing because it could not fulfill the definition of stealing.
3. we knew already from the very beginning that most malays in malaysia are immigrants from indonesia. as mike said they are twins of the indonesian, so they shared the same culture, the same heritage, the same ancestors. and we shouldnot deny their right to their culture and so on, they can practice or commercialize or whatever as they like because it is their culture, their right and nobody can stop them

so i wanna ask uguys a just question, to look whether u dare enough to answer my question, um especially mike though…

Should the rasa sayang song belongs to nusantara or indonesia??? if not please specify why. And should we allow the MTB to continue to use this song commercially??? if not, pls specify why oso. i remind uguys the reasons must be facts and law…please donot repeat those crappy emotions

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thanx…im going back on the day before raya, friday. got oncall on thursday, the raya season cause our emergency department full of 3 expected cases- motor-vehicle accident, crushed hand injuries due to that sugarcane machine and burns from firecrakcers. haha quite typical every year and suprisingly cases of other kinds dropped drastically.

and about the origin of the malays, i wanna say its another misunderstanding among uguys foreigner. We do know that we are not originally from here, even high school textbooks stated that the parameswara was from java being chased by those majapahit ppl and some of us also from china. its not that we do not know, we know it and we admit it. its just that it was never mentioned in the constitution, got to blame those who created the constitution, u know who they are.

i bet u know oso why they are doing this, for the NEP of course, so-called to protect the interest of malays and to throw away those malays who had converted to other religion or their culture, i think. the real thing is to protect the crony of their and make them even fatter. However, its a definition in the Malaysian Constitution, technically this has nothing to do with other malays in other countries. for u to have really fight it like hell for those malays in indonesia, i think to really make it as a reason to challenge the constitution is not sensible because its out of the constitution’s jurisdiction.

about the “sons-the-soil” thing, i think again u all got it wrong. now this thing really didnt appear at the early stage of malaysian establishment. Because malaysia is actually a federation between numbers of sultanates in the peninsular. when we are nearing the independance from british rule, of course all the ethnics at that time have to unite, malays, chinese miners and indian planter. they sorts things out that the malays will give citizenship rights to the other ethnics that come later and the other ethnics should respect malays special rights in the constitution.

later due to the 1969 ethnic conflict in malaysia, the UMNO created the NEP by using the malays special rights in the constitution to ensure nation’s wealth being divided equally bet all races. before 1969, most cities and economy were dominated by chinese. and of course those days most of the ppl support this because it plays an important role in rearraging the society, bring malays out from villages to cities and bringing out indians from plantations. but, it only worked those days and not these days.

nowadays ppl aledy tired of it, because the wealth most go to their crony, even the malays poor were marginalized, not to mentioned chinese and indians, they are the worst, pity them. but then in order for the UMNO to maintain their political grip, they came out with this ketuanan melayu etc crap just to grab more on the far-right voters. technically they even lost malays votes in the 1999 general election but due to their alliance with chinese MCA and indian MIC, they were able to maintain power. In 2004 gen election, they came up with this redefining the election borders, analyzing their strength and weakness making them able to win more seats even with slim majority, so they got away with it lah…

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No not few, actually got alot especially those ppl that backs the Islamist opposition party that ruled Kelantan. u know for me these islamists are better of voted than those ultranationalist UMNO. although some of their policy like Islamic state, strict sharia law, hudud etc really scared away those non-muslim chinese and indians but these islamists really stand up for poor chinese and indians.

u know why the opposition lost in 1999, the malays mostly voted the opposition but the non-muslim non-malays are so scared of these Islamist so they stayed with BN. at that time got alot of media propaganda and all to scare them away. i can assured uguys, in kelantan we can see it is more democratic than the rest of the nation even though it is ruled by islamists. just dont worry about the islamic state, sharia law and so on, those things are not meant for nonmuslims.

even my chinese and indian friends who first came to this state is quite astonished. here u can get malay kids going to chinese schools, even can speak mandarin. restaurants here u can see got 2 parts, malays selling the food and chinese selling drinks, all in one roof. its really an integrated society even with all the media propaganda. im so proud that i can see these things…

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Dear Michael.

I refer to your statement with regards to Malaysian Govt’s “alleged” massive propaganda concerning Malays are actually migrants.

Actually, it was not a propaganda. Malaysia was previously known an Malay states. It was then a worldwide recognition. What you fail to understand that Malays are the first race to set up system of governance here .

What is world wide recognition. All foreign powers recognised such facts. All treaties were inked between Malay Sultans and foreign powers, be they were Dutch, or British. That act of of inking treaties showed that they recognised you.

Even during the worst days of Malays( that was Malayan Union), British still recognised such fact. Malay Sultans were threatened to sign treaties with London to give away their sovereignty.

Instruments of Independence itself was between London and Malay Rulers just weeks before August 31,1957.

What I am trying to say is that the present structure of Malaysia is due to its history. Chinese, Indians are now citizens of malaysia. So, why ridicule malaysian Govt or Malays or UMNO.

What I notice a lot of people like tend to forget is that Malays beside “receiving” also “gives” a lot. However due to the natures of Malays on not telling the whole world about their gifts, they are often chided.

Not believing me? Please tell me who are State Assemblies or Member of Parliaments for constituents like Kulim, Lunas( Kedah), Gunung semanggol, sungai Siput( Perak), among others. With the highest of regards to these politicians, without Malay supports, all of them will lose election. Yes, UMNO receives Chinese votes also. And you cant deny that many MCA , MIC politicians will not survive without UMNO’s support. So , be fair while criticizing.

The truth is that if UMNO had really wanted to rule the country on its own, it can easily do so. It had ample times to do so. If you care to look at number of UMNO state assemblies, you will notice that it can easily form state govts in many states.

It is willing to give more than receive. It can easily take Chief Ministership post of Penang in 1990 if it had really wanted to as it is the party with the highest number of seats within Barisan National, But in humility, it allowed Gerakan to lead the state.

I am not denying Chinese and Indian contribution in Malaysia. They contribute a lot. But To infer that Malays are good for nothing(that is how I feel after reading your remarks) is hitting below the belt.

Malays have a lot of problems. So are the Chinese and Indians, each with particular concern. Malaysia( meaning UMNO led Govt) may not be perfect . Go on criticize but at the same time recognises that it also delivers.

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I am not denying Chinese and Indian contribution in Malaysia. They contribute a lot. But To infer that Malays are good for nothing(that is how I feel after reading your remarks) is hitting below the belt.
MC: Perhaps that is just how you feel after reading th pot, and that is your right. However, you brought in a lot of Political parties and listed the great things they did and so on. I’m not challenging them and yet I’m not agreeing or denying them. What we have been discussing so far ha not been political. Why bring it in?

MC: Didn’t I already tell you what we are all against? Pleae re-read this segement from tmy post above:

“What boils a lot of us is the fact that some rich ass datuk’s and tan sri’s child is taking up space in the “handout” line for education scholarhips when the really needy are pushed aside. So what happens is the poor Malays in Malaysia become poorer and the rich become richer. The top level would try as hard as they can to ensure the continuity of this poverty to make sure that there are “examples” to show when they say “The Malays are dirt ass poor. Think I’m kidding? watch this segment on Hard Talk by the BBC and see how the Foreign Minister of Malaysia gets his ass grilled by the British

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/hardtalk/6992908.stm

This immediately tells you the main subject of discussion. The Malaysian Malays are NOT receiving their peruntukan. Plain and simple. I have moved around this country to see the lack of it. I’d be happy to be proven wrong, and I stand corrected when the facts present itself.

“Malays have a lot of problems. So are the Chinese and Indians, each with particular concern. Malaysia( meaning UMNO led Govt) may not be perfect . Go on criticize but at the same time recognises that it also delivers…”
MC: Most of us also agree that the government does deliver. That is not the question. The question is, as we all ask, at what rate. Improving from an attap hut to a zink sheet hut is improvement. But is it fair to the Malaysian Malays?

Let’s look at how one “ex-state” of Malaysia has really changed their “Backwater Third World Country status” from having absolutely NO RESOUCES to becoming the ONLY First World Country in Southeast Asia. Look at how the S$ and the RM was of equal value. Why is the RM only worth 0.43 of the S$ today? Why is it that they could progress at a rate that Malaysia cannot? Where’s the Malaysia Boleh? To sya that Malaysian Politicans are deficient is unfair. But to say that corruption is too rampant that even the Local Malays are shortchanged and not given their appropriation is the reality.

Since you brought it up, you mentioned that UMNO etc has had plenty of time. Sure, we agree with you, but isn’t that same time you just mentioned enough to bring Malaysia on par with its ex-state? Considering that Brunei has massive Oil resources, and that the Sultan of Brunei is one of the rivhest men in the world, and Singapore has none of the above, isn’t it amazing that somehow the two countries have equal monetary power?

I’d be more than happy to eat my words when the RM is on par with the Singapore $. But until that happens, boys, there’s hell of a lot of work to be done. So let’s not pat ourselves on the back until that happens-ya?

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I don’t quite get why we, Indonesians, have to be so mad about this whole ‘Rasa Sayang’ issue. If we’re talking copyright, well… we’d have to ask ourselves: does the Indonesian copyright system actually exist… and if it is (as some musicians out there might point out), is it really working?

It might sound so simple and shallow, but really, I think of this as something that’s effective to slap Indonesia’s music industry -and the government as well- awake. If Malaysia is considered ‘stealing’ our ‘musical asset’, then what have we done all these time to protect it?

Several e-mails were dropped into my inbox today about this, asking me to sign the petition to protest Malaysia’s ‘stealing’. I didn’t even bother to check the petition link because by not signing it, I’m showing my protest to the Indonesian government on their laziness that caused the copyright overlooking.

I am not defending the Malaysians here, just trying to think with a level-head. I mean come on, think of it this way: the Malays have at least a copy of one Indonesian song in their iTunes… and we Indonesians wouldn’t mind to sing along with Sheila Majid. And if the Malays are a wee bit faster than us to use one of our songs for their business, then whose stupidity is that? Sad to say that it’s ours. We didn’t guard what belongs to us carefully. So who’s to blame? As much as I hate to say this, it’s not exactly the Malays.

Being a proud Indonesian does NOT mean we can point fingers and be rude. True we’ve been having major hiccups with Malaysia, but again that doesn’t mean we can run out of CLASS. If a fight is indeed needed eventually…

…please fight gracefully.

Because Indonesians are graceful and educated people.

And for Unspun, thank you for bringing up this issue and manages to stay objective. I wanted to stay objective in the first place, but I’m sorry I have to tell you that nobody in this world can beat the real Ambonese when it comes to singing the ‘Rasa Sayange’ song 😀

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If Malaysia ‘is stealing’ something from the Indonesians, what exactly do you Indonesian lose? Do you really lose a song? You are making fuss for something that you didnt care before. You didnt even use it as your theme to show any of your cultural pride!

Remember one thing, Ambonese / Maluku was OCCUPIED by the Indonesian troops somewhere in the 50’s and later claimed it its own. Can we call this ‘stealing’? Therefore before that, Rasa Sayange had nothing to do with Indonesia at all. Can we call this an ‘occupied song’?

How about the Happy Birthday song? Dont you feel like stealing something from someone during those ‘happy moments’?

And If I recall, the only “serumpun” country that attacked and killed Malaysian people in an open war was Indonesia. What do we call this?

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Dear kAMARUL.

First, I do not have the habit of ridiculing others. and I am not even an UMNO members.

With due respect to you, kindly refrain from that kind of insinuation should you wish to pursue a meaningful discussion. As for Malaysia, like every country on earth, there is poverty. But to quote “Malays are dirt ass poor” is demeaning. You of course, will be heralded but of course no respect will be accorded by those who even agree with you.

There are poor malays. No doubt about that. I have seen some of them and feel like crying. But there is also a sizable segment of Malays in middle class section.

How do they come to that level? Pure coincidence?Not necessarily. Hard work? Yes. And also govt’s help. There is no denying on that.

Surely, you cant deny that Govt( meaning UMNO led Govt) does deliver. Sizable number of Malay professionals around the globe exist because our leaders had the courage to implement a practical policy although condemned by the western world; that is Dasar Ekonomi Baru.

I may not be rich but certainly not dirt ass poor. Using that kind of language is an insult to malays. I am not sure whether you are a Malay yourself.

As for Tan Sri’s son getting scholarship, please bring the matter to proper channel. As for Foreign Minister being grilled by BBC with regards to poverty, may I remind that poverty also exists on that part of Suez Canal. There are quite a number of homeless people .

So, be fair while criticizing.

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Do you know how many (educated) Malays were insulted by that statement?

BTW He (Alba) also mentioned that more non Malays are going to Universities in Malaysia when asked about whether non-Malays had opportunities to enter Universities in Malaysia.

And in response to the issue of Lina Joy, his response was that no one in Malaysia is allowed to change their name on their IC. Period. Totally forgetting that when one converts to Islam (masuk Islam) one changes the name on his or her IC.

Alba also said that one can freely change from being a Muslim to Christianity, or any religion that one wants to. He must have totally forgotten about the strict apostacy laws mentioned in the Koran, punishable by death. What type of hopeless Minister is this?

I think you’d better watch this for yourself.

Cheers Man

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If only the Malaysian Gov’t has the heart and sensibility of NOT using a song which is also acclaimed as a folk song in another country (Indonesia, that is) as a jingle for the country’s tourism advertising (thus making it sound like it originated from Malaysia), this kind of argument (and harsh comments from some Indonesians) will never show up. Indonesians are basically friendly people. They respect others who respect them.

And by the way, a recording company from Solo-Indonesia turns out keeping a record of the song recorded back in 1962. According to James F. Sundah, a notable Indonesian musician, if there is ever a conflict between two countries over claim right of a song, it is the country keeping the first or earliest record which will retain the right. If you understand Bahasa Indonesia, please read the related article at http://www.kompas.com/ver1/Hiburan/0710/09/162051.htm

Since Malaysia and Indonesia have so many similar culture, next time Malaysians claim something of their cultural heritage, please make sure you add “Malaysian” or “Malaysian version” in front of it, for example “Malaysian batik” or “Malaysian version of batik” instead of simply “batik”. I think that’ll help settle the case a lot. Thanks.

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Dear Michael.

I was responding to Kamarul. He uses the insulting term “Malays dirt ass poor”. Now I know that there are quite a number of Malays who are poor. There is no denying on that.

And you also cant deny that there are also poor Chinese and Indians and other races. Poverty is not limited to one race only. But to insult with the terminology “dirt ass poor”, is a relection of poor breeding. That much I can say.

My point is very clear. En Kamarul may want to forget also sizable Malays in middle class section so that he can “basuh” his own government. These Malays may not be filthy rich but they have comfortable life.

Whateever said and done, he himself cant deny that Malaysia is considered a success story in poverty eradication. Yes, there are still poverty like in every country on this planet. But he must also acknowkledge that his govt( meaning the govt led by the pary he hates, UMNO) does deliver despite warts and all.

And despite whatever people said, our Foreign Minister is right. NEP does not make Chinese and Indiand poorer. And is it a fact that percapita income of Chinese is higher than that of Malays and Indians.

As for rich Tan Sri’s sons getting scholarship, please bring the matter to proper channel. But Kamarul or anybody cant deny that ten of thousands of Malays from humble background had been given chances to pursue education overseas and also locally. I know as I also came from a very humble background. Without govt scholarship, I will not be able to be who I am now.

And this is not my story alone. Today I have many kampung friends who are engineers in countries like Chad, Sudan, Vietnam. Perhaps En Kamarul should do some soul searching before succumb to this habit of ridiculing his own govt.

As for your preoccupation ( and of course RaJA Petra) that malays are also migrants, that is your right. But do remember that world does think differently. If you care( if only) to peruse historical instruments, you will notice that Malays have been accepted as people of the land by everybody. All foreign treaties were inked between foreign powers and Malay rulers. As i said earlier, Instruments of Independence itself was actually a treaty between London and Malay Rulers, signed just weeks before August 31, 1957 to sever whatever administrative ties between Britain and then Malaya.

I fail to see the the need to question such facts. In no way that such fact denies the rights of other races in Malaysia. That is the beauty in Malaysia. Right of every races is respected. Vernacular schools flourish in Malaysia, a rarity in this world. Non Malay politicians can still win in Malay majority area. No Malay politician I am sure can win in a Chinese majority area.

As for our exchange rate with Singapore, En Kamarul may have forgotten that billions of ringgit “went down into drain” literally just to support artificial rate. Thank God, finally sanity prevails on those in corridors of power in Malaysia.

I am not saying that there is no problem in Malaysia. Like any country, Malaysia has its share of problem. What I cant accept is the attitude of insinuating just because people like Kamarul and you think it is trendy to say so. I accept criticism, not insulting remarks.

And if you do not like our politicians, just change them. Election is around the corner.

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I really really think Indonesia government should protect the culture assets. There are many songs and crafts and more that has grown and has developed into its own characteristic in Indonesia for hundred of years now. Sometimes who created it is unknown. Now that is the very strong reason for another country to steal it And leave nothing for Indonesia to defend it. I don’t think a war is the best option, just put away to garbage can some sentence like “serumpun” or “saudara” so that makes Indonesia could act in straight without having to worry about anything. Really, Indonesia should move along and go ahead with full protection and full patents of cultures that has developed in Indonesia itself. I don’t think you can take or even steal something that has developed in a certain origin for hundreds of years and has it’s own characteristic by just using the word “serumpun” or ” it’s originated from melayu”. No way, man. It doesn’t sound logic.
A culture is not like genetic heritance… if a great-great-great-great grandchildren with darker skin have a great-great-great-great grandfather who has a lighter skin they can be said related based on genetic traits.
But you can’t do that to a culture… I think people in the world is smart enough to differetiate which one is Malaysia culture and which one is Indonesia culture. Indonesia culture is the more and more and far exotic ones and far more richer. Indonesia government should really take a protection action in a very top list.

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Lagu Rasa Sayange Direkam di Lokananta

SOLO, SELASA – Departemen Kebudayaan dan Pariwisata mengumpulkan bukti-bukti autentik tentang kepemilikan lagu Rasa Sayange yang saat ini digunakan Malaysia untuk promosi pariwisata di negara tersebut.

Salah satu upaya yang dilakukan adalah dengan mendatangi perusahaan rekaman Lokananta di Solo yang masih menyimpan bukti-bukti tersebut, kata Kabid Informasi dan Publikasi Departemen Kebudayaan dan Pariwisata Jordi Paliama pada wartawan di Solo, Selasa.

Salah satu bukti kuat bahwa lagu itu merupakan milik Indonesia adalah adanya piringan hitam yang berisi lagu-lagu tersebut yang pertama kali direkam di perusahaan rekaman Lokananta Solo. Bahkan Lokananta juga masih menyimpan pita real atau rekaman suara sebelum akhirnya dicetak menjadi piringan hitam yang direkam tahun 1962.

“Kedatangan kita ke sini untuk mencari bukti autentik bahwa lagu itu miliki Indonesia. Hal ini juga menunjukkan sikap pemerintah terkait penggunaan lagu Rasa Sayange oleh Malaysia,” katanya.

Lokananta sendiri saat ini masih menyimpan sebanyak tujuh piringan hitam berisi lagu Rasa Sayange. Lagu ini direkam dan diperbanyak hingga 100 piringan hitam dan dijadikan souvenir saat Asean Games IV.

Menurut Jordi dengan adanya rekaman lagu yang pertama kali dibuat itu, maka hal ini menjadi bukti kuat bahwa Malaysia memang mencontek lagu Rasa Sayange. “Kami juga sudah melakukan kontak dengan publik Maluku dan pengarang lagu seniman Maluku untuk menbuktikan bahwa lagu itu dari Maluku. Dan menurut publik Maluku, lagu itu sudah dinyanyikan sejak tahun 20-an oleh warga Maluku,” jelasnya.

Selain itu, pada tahun 1951, ternyata lagu itu juga sudah dinyanyikan di hadapan Presiden RI pertama, Soekarno, saat meresmikan pembangunan Gereja Maranata di Maluku. Dan pada tahun itu, Malaysia belum merdeka.

Lebih lanjut menurut Jordi, meskipun pihaknya memiliki bukti autentik berupa rekaman asli, tetapi pihaknya mengakui bahwa bukti itu masih belum kuat, pasalnya lagu tersebut tidak diketahui siapa yang menciptanya dan hanya mencantumkan NN (no name) dalam nama pencipta.

“Tetapi menurut James F Sundah, jika ada perselisihan di antara dua negara mengenai klaim sebuah lagu, maka negara yang menang adalah mereka yang memiliki rekaman lagu itu pertama kali dibuat. Kita patut bersyukur, sebab, di Lokananta masih menyimpan rekaman lagu ini yang dibuat tahun 1962,” paparnya.

Selain mencari bukti di Lokananta, pihak Departemen Kebudayaan dan Pariwisata juga mengumpulkan bukti-bukti dari Minoru Endo Music Fundation di Jepang. Diharapkan di Minoru Endo ini, bisa ditemukan kumpulan lagu-lagu asli Indonesia yang diserahkan kepada mereka dari Indonesia untuk dibuat buku berisikan lagu-lagu dari berbagai negara.

“Mungkin lagu itu masuk dalam daftar yang kita serahkan kepada mereka, dan karena keterbatasan kuota maka hanya ada 20 lagu saja yang dicantumkan sebagai lagu asli dari Indonesia tanpa mencantumkan lagu Rasa Sayange di dalamnya,” jelasnya.

Sementara itu Kepala Cabang Perum Percetaan Negara Lokananta Solo, Ruktiningsih mengatakan, piringan hitam berisi lagu-lagu daerah termasuk Rasa Sayange direkam di Lokananta pada tanggal 15 Agustus 1962 dan diperbanyak hingga 100 keping piringan hitam. Hal ini dilakukan atas perintah dari Presiden Soekarno kepada Menteri Penerangan waktu itu, R Maladi. “Saat ini kami masih punya tujuh keping piringan hitam berisi lagu itu,” ujarnya. (Ant/wsn)

“sorry cant be bothered to translate these into english, just read it. at least it’s not in malay languange, which sucks a lot more than Indonesian.”

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INDONESIA RAYA MERDEKA MERDEKA HIDUPLAH INDONESIA RAYA..

myASSia, tanks atas informasi untuk pembuktian bahwa lagu RASA SAYANGE punya INDONESIA..

Rest of posting is deleted because it contains unnecessary expletives (Unspun is no prude – expletives allowed in this if they are effective in expressing something but if it only reflects a limited ability to argue and express oneself then they are deleted), inflammatory language that does not advance any argument or add to the discussion.

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Dear Tried To be honest.

Many thanks for your remarks. Perhaps clearer mind will help to solve whatever issues between the two countries.

Rasa Sayang issue is actually an after effect saga. The real issue is “alleged” Indonesia’s unsatifaction with Malaysia. Unsatisfaction I notice is due to mainly sensational reporting by Indonesian media.

Indonesian media is quick to report when a maid was badly treated by her employer. But they never report about hundreds of maid who ran away after looting lady of the house’s jewellery besides unbelievable phone bill. No Indonesia media ever willing to report about more than 20000 maids who ran away simply because they are seduced by again their Indonesian boyfriend.

Of course, no Indonesian press is willing to carry stories about several young girls who are raped by Indonesian migrants, not to mentioned tribal clash between those from Madura and that of other parts of Indonesia.

No Indonesia press is willing to highlight the issues on Indonesian agents who lied by giving false details on Indonesian maids, thus making these unemployable women rejected in their own country to look like angels . No Indonesian president cares to to look into plight of Indonesian maids who are forced to bribe Indonesian oficials at Indonesian port so that these maids can return to Malaysia after a holiday.

Coupled with inability to accept ICj’s ruling that sovereignty of Pulau Sipadan and Ligitan is with Malaysia, together with upset over Malaysia’s refusal to kowtow to self appointed Big Brother( Indonesia), Rasa Sayang issue is actually not surprising.

In the first place, Malaysians fail to understand what is the fuss over the song. Malaysia never claims it owns Rasa Sayang exclusively . It just brilliantly uses the song for promotion exrecise.

Malaysia does not even know that Indonesia feels that it owns the song. The folk song is quite famous in this region. Malaysia feels that any country in this region can use it.

The more appropriate reaction is for Indonesia to learn about successful Malaysia’s tourism promotion. No need to be shy about it. Being a good copycat is not degrading.

As for readers who are fond to ridicule( whether Malaysians or Indonesians), my advice is to mind your mannerism. No need to mock . Just present your views minus insulting remarks .

I am not saying that all Indonesian grouses with Malaysia are invalid. Some incidents with regards to inhuman treatments of Indonesian maids warrants Jakarta’s attention. But, do remember Malaysia also cooperates by taking actions vs cruel employers.

As for Malaysia, perhaps the honourable PM should rethink the overly liberal immigration policies. It is disaster in the making. As for Malaysians, maybe it is time to do some soul searching. Overly dependence on foreigners can be fatal to the countries.

Why not take a small first step. Teach our childrens to wash their own dishes, clothes. And for men, it is high time to help the wives with household chores. And for Putrajaya, why not encourages the opening of day care centreds by unemployed graduates.

And my advice to the Honourable Labour Minister, do “turun padang” to understand that acutes shortages of workers is mainly due to unbelievably low salary. Not believing me. A multinational factory in Shah Alam offers salary of Rm18 per day for 9 to 5 job.

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Responding to the comment above, I read a comment once saying that back in the “Orde Lama” days when Suharto still has all the power in Indonesia, an agreement was made between him and the reigning Malaysian PM to export Indonesian workers to Malaysia in order to maintain the population of the malay decent so it won’t be outnumbered by other ethnicities there. Further study is needed though.
However, now the number may have exceeded remarkably with all the illegal immigrants, but still, it all started with a deal made by both countries so cutting all Indonesian workers in malaysia is absolutely impossible. Cos on the other hand, Malaysia need Indonesians to save themselves.

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I like Metty’s quote:
… Since Malaysia and Indonesia have so many similar culture, next time Malaysians claim something of their cultural heritage …, please make sure you add “Malaysian” or “Malaysian version” in front of it, for example “Malaysian batik” or “Malaysian version of batik” …

I wonder why myASSia keeps insulting himself. I think if you want to insult someone, don’t use the same word as your own name. It’s like pointing to yourself. So are dloozer, mr.puki… (^_^) Just my oppinion.

Dear Shiz, it’s a known secret!! Sheeeess… keep quite, ISA may visit you tonight. Good Luck :p unless if you are Indonesian, then I guess it’s alrite. Ha ha

Just wondering, any “Malays” here tried to track your roots? Would unspun like to start a new topic on this? Where exactly your ancesters came from before we have Malaysia & Indonesia.
Why are some Selangorians still call themselves Javanese, Johoreans call themselves Bugis even when their ancesters were here centuries ago. Does Jakarta people call themselves Jakartarians?

I somehow noticed that Malaysian refer to themselves more on ethnic references as in Malay, Chinese, Indians instead of Malaysian unlike the Indonesian counter part.

Dear Shamshul anuar, just wondering if you could tell me what is the earliest civilization or ruler in the Malay Peninsula. Not so good in history myself but a bit doubtful “Malays” were the first race to set up system of governance here .
BTW, how do you define “Malays”.

Dear kamarul, not sure if u r a PAS supporter but lets keep this dicussion out from Malaysia Politics. No government is perfect and I doub’t the oppositions could do a better job. But we still need them to keep the government at check. I like Kelantan, it’s a nice place but a little hard to maintain my living styles as in KL and not offending the Malay locals. HA HA HA. I missed the food there!! Also it’s scary for the state government to ban it’s local traditions just because it’s against Islamic teaching. I thought Islam is tolerant and blends to local cultures. Can advise?

Ha ha ha ha, sorry for the mess, I started out just to comment on Metty’s quote.

SELAMAT HARI RAYA

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geopolitis sebuah bangsa tidak hanya dari ras melayu, ras jawa, tetapi kalo kata soekarno,

“Maka manakah yang dinamakan tanah tumpah-darah kita, tanah air kita? Menurut geopolitik, maka Indonesialah tanah air kita. Indonesia yang bulat, bukan Jawa saja, bukan Sumatera saja, atau Borneo saja, atau Selebes saja, atau Ambon saja, atau Maluku saja, tetapi segenap kepulauan uang ditunjuk oleh Allah s.w.t. menjadi suatu kesatuan antara dua benua dan dua samudera, itulah tanah air kita!”

http://id.wikisource.org/wiki/Pidato_Soekarno:_Lahirnya_Pancasila

jadi memang dalam bangsa yang diapit 2 benua dan 2 samudra ini terjadi banyak sharing of culture and life. tapi sayangnya terbentuk beberapa negara di antara 2 benua dan 2 samudra ini. kalo masih sama2 di majapahit kan gampang. kalo bukan karena pemisahan eic dan voc, most likely kita udah jadi 1 negara.

tapi dalam hal ini, menurutku indonesia masih tetap memiliki semangat of the diverse archipelago (rasa toleransi antara diversitas) yang lebih mewakili keutuhan kepulauan-kepulauan asia tenggara ketimbang malaysia.

pesan: at our conception, we should’ve been in the same nation.

tapi mari jangan dilihat secara negatif (meributkan batas negara, toh majapahit sudah berlalu) tapi secara positif (mampu toleransi n tepo seliro)

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what a llooonnng thread…huh..penatnye nak baca manakan nak comment

anyway to Shamsul…i think u dreamed alot lah, when did i say those words???? i never agreed with anybody who said those words. yeah mike u should withdraw that one…its too harsh for those hot steam

Shamsul oooohhhh Shamsul, its not that i wanna ridicule u whatsoever, its just i wanna poke ur thinking so that u think right. not just angguk2 geleng2 wit what the govern said. now don’t say im tak kenang budi whatsoever. we all know its the NEP that those guys claimed to be a success story…its a subjective issue. some say its a success coz alot gained from it and some say its a failure coz it didnot even achieve what it aims. furthermore alot others should gain, we can achieve more if the govern listen but they don’t. im not arguing about those who gained but please think of those who do not.

im a malay and of course if according to Shamsul, i gained alot and i should thank the govern. but logically when we think about poverty eradication program, the main aim is to eradicate poverty, isnt it Shamsul???? so the ppl that we should help by giving away money are those who are poor, isnt it Shamsul??? then why not we give help to the needy based on their income level???? Isnt it more logical and strategically wiser???? if we do like this, the possibility to achieve what we aimed is more???? better strategy, higher possibility and higher success rate, isnt it Shamsul????

Now if u are such a thinking man, explain to me why not we eradicate poverty based on the ppl income rate, Shamsul??? I dare u….

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Vic.Kyle.Ellanne:

Dear kamarul, not sure if u r a PAS supporter but lets keep this dicussion out from Malaysia Politics. No government is perfect and I doub’t the oppositions could do a better job. But we still need them to keep the government at check. I like Kelantan, it’s a nice place but a little hard to maintain my living styles as in KL and not offending the Malay locals. HA HA HA. I missed the food there!! Also it’s scary for the state government to ban it’s local traditions just because it’s against Islamic teaching. I thought Islam is tolerant and blends to local cultures. Can advise?

well, im not a PAS supporter as im still studying in a local U and the AUKU said well that im not. my commment was for Shamsul indeed on the NEP issue, sorry to have confused u on this Rasa Sayang hey thread. of course there would be no govern is perfect, but hey if u doubt the opposition will perform, why don’t we give them a chance in the next gen election??? on common ground, ive seen well in Kelantan and prev Terengganu, but um lets give them a chance for fed govern, then we can argue later hehe hooray…just give the chance and if they donot perform well, we just choose BN again…it is like serampang 2 mata, the next BN will not dare to not listen to the ppl again rite???

yeah the food is good but u know ppl here really eat sugar alot, which gives a total headache for us meds student hehe…too many cases with the same story all over again. wana tell u my experience here lah…ive given a chance to go deep into the local community for 2 years doing medical research…the malays and nonmalays here is such a good example of an integrated society but um most of us donot know really. Malays go to chinese school, can speak mandarin. chinese can read jawi and eat budu. poltically here even u can get chinese tok penghulu in a malay kampong.

yes Islam is tolerant and it can blends into local culture except if the culture in any way does not comply to Islamic shara'(laws). yeah there are few things being banned here in Kelantan including the wayang kulit thing but um the reality is it is not totally banned. the only thing they prohibited is the mixture of male and female(nonmuhrim) couple in dark places. they do have alot of complaints on this issue. the wayang kulit show still goes on in Kelantan if the environment is correct ie the place is not too dark. we oso have it here in HUSM. they even wanna to open up on the cinema issue…so we just wait them to open up ok…;-)

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to hell with the stupid rasa sayange Indon. No meaning at all, perang saja dengan Indon!!! Timur Leste pun bisa merdeka.

@dolah: Hmmm. Not a very skillful way of arguing. Emotive and provocative language is not contributing to this discussion at all. Is there a point you want to make or you just want to rail at someone? If former, please rephrase. If latter, get a prescription for Prozac and refrain from listening to Kenny G music.

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Malaysia Goblok, Maling!!!

Apalagi Kamarul!

Siape yg ga emosi ketika banyak orang Indonesia dilecehin, diperkosa sama Rela, dijarah kebudayaannya, diambil pulaunye, TITIT!!!!!!!!!!

GOBLOK!!!!!!!!!!!

GANyANG MAlaYSia

@Otong: please see Unspun’s comments to dolah. You two have the same malaise and need the same treatment. Maybe we should lock you two in a room and force you to make love to each other. LOL

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Well my malaysian fried said he never realized that indonesians appreciate product of culture so highly. For him this song is just another folk song from the archipelago.

I explained to him that in Indonesia, ppl really put emphasize on the locality and originality of products of culture. Most indonesia will probably know that the song Bunga Jempa is from Aceh and Angin Mamiri from Makassar. We’ve been introduced this concept of locality since elementary school. Indonesia has so much products of culture/art from different ethnicity/tribe and to preserve them is by recognizing its origin. This also meant to to increase cultural sensitivity and lessen the possibility of the ethic/tribe conflict.

We have this concept local culture enrich national culture. Still, we distinguish which one is local and which one has become national. Batik, Kebaya and Kopiah somehow has become national, yet we still recognize its origin.

This emphasize on originality and localty can be seen in naming the food. We have Soto Banjar, Soto Madura, Soto (Coto) Makassar, Soto Betawi, Soto Bandung, etc. Of course anyone can cook this food and commercial it anywhere in indonesia but still they have to recognize where it comes from. It is not written law but is what we believe to be ethical. You just can’t make Soto Banjar, sell it in Ambon and then name it Soto Ambon. Indonesian in Banjarmasin will be furious. The same rule goes to Batik, wayang, and so on.

Songs like Rayuan Pulau Kelapa, Tanah Airku, etc as we know has been regarded as national indonesian songs. While, Angin Mamiri, Rasa Sayange, Bunga Jeumpa as local indonesian (folk) songs.

My malaysian friend said that malay Malaysian are used to mixing Nusantare culture and just regarded them as Malay which is from the archipelago. Our understanding of Malay/Melayu is different. To him most of the people in archipelago is Malay. To him Malay/Melayu is a race. While for us Malay/Melayu is a minority tribe in Sumatra which mostly in Riau. Its culture is just small part of the archipelago and to our common knowledge rasa sayange, batik and wayang is not originated from Melayu culture.

For me, knowing that, Malay Malaysian are mostly come from indonesia, they have the same right as much as indonesians do in practising those products of culture. But, of course they must acknowledge where it comes from and its originality. if Malaysians reluctant to admit this shared heritage as Indonesian’s why dont just admit its local origin, like Maluku’s song for this rasa sayange.

Chinese everywhere, for example, surely acknowledge barongsai as their motherland heritage. Why Malay Malaysian can’t do the same. We wonder that that it might due to the hardship that indonesians facing now that malay malaysian may feel reluctant to acknowledge itself as Indonesian descendant and now trying to detach and disassociate itself to Indonesia.

Or is it perhaps because now Malaysia economically more advance than indonesia? or maybe because there are too many indonesian hard labour in malaysia ? I dont know, im just wondering. Not acknowleging the originality of songs or any kind product of culture for that matter, particulary personalizing it by commercial use relatively considered ignorance. ignorance equals arrogant. That’s the way indonesian see it, i suppose.

Anyway, malaysian tourist/visitor in indonesia are hardly shown hostility or resentment towards them because they are malaysian. We may say Ganyang malaysia but i don’t think any malaysian will be hurt by the police or by anyone in indonesia. Some stupid indonesian may burn jalur gemilang in front malaysian embassy but i dont think any indonesian will think to actually hurt a malaysian in indonesia.

I love malaysia when i visited it, but i prefer going to bangkok or singapore instead. Perhaps im too sensitive, but when i was in malaysia, i can feel resentment or changing of facial expression if i said that im indonesian to malaysian officials.

I hope this mentality towards indonesians would change someday.

Peace

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winterinoz said it all. I hope Malaysians read his (or her?) comment. For us Indonesians, it is important to note the origin of a cultural product.

To Kamarul who keeps asking Indonesians to prove that Rasa Sayange as Indonesian song, read the comments from Singaporeexpats and MyAssia (although I don’t like the way he call your country in that insulting way). It seems you just don’t want to admit being wrong.
BTW, about the maturity as a nation, let me tell you what I think (you may or may not agree). If you think Malaysian condition now (politically and socially) as a nation is civilized and mature, I can’t help to think of Indonesia during Soeharto era. I think that Malaysian situation now is just like Indonesia during that era.

I got the impression from the comments of Malaysians in this blog that it seems your media has portraited us in such a way as very poor, Pancasila as failed principles (while many of you don’t even know what stated in Pancasila), and everything in Indonesia is bad and all Indonesians are low class workers. I understand your situation, it’s just like the media in Indonesia during Soeharto era who portraited everything abt Indonesia as good and other countries are bad. My suggestion is, please see the whole picture before making any comment, don’t just trust your (control-freak) government and media.

Sometimes I found your comments become so funny, like Kersani who commented on the recent Bawang Merah Bawang Putih sinetron. Even small children in Indonesia will laugh at you. The legend has existed a long time ago and we also had a movie abt it (I think it was still black and white movie). Or comment from Shanghai who talk abt Happy Birthday song, hahahahaha you make my day, man. None of us in Indonesia claim it as Indonesian song. We definitely acknowledge it as foreign song.

BTW, what winterinoz said is true that we Indonesians might expressed our disgust on certain things (or certain country) by holding a protest and burning flags, but we don’t go attacking or harrassing the people from that country. You know how many times we burned US or Australian flags? But we don’t harrassed the people of those countries in their daily life in Indonesia. We still respect them as human being, and that is what I heard is lost in the way many Malaysians treat Indonesians. I myself has the experienced being ignored and looked down by Malaysians just because I am Indonesian.

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Yesterday, at the Bundaran HI, Jakarta, ppl burning flags of Indonesian Party: Golkar, PDIP, PKS etc. Eventhough I am somewhat not agree with this burning flags thing (including burning Malaysian flag) but I do respect their free spirit to express.

Malaysia, on the other hand still experience this:

Malaysia down in press freedom index by CIJ, 17 October 2007
Source : CIJ / http://www.cijmalaysia.org/display_story.asp?id=546

The Centre for Independent Journalism (CIJ) notes with concern Malaysia’s drastic drop in this year’s Press Freedom Index by Reporters Without Borders (RSF), in which the country now ranked at 124, a drop of 32 places from year 2006 where it occupied the 92nd spot. It is worrying to note that the decline has been precedented by an improvement in the 2006 index, in which Malaysia climbed up 21 notches from 2005.

However, CIJ agrees with the RSF’s observation in its annual report about Malaysia, and our monitoring reveals a consistent trend in the following areas; the harassment of bloggers through police detention, questioning, defamation suit, as well as warning by the country’s top leadership.
constant interference by the Executive in editorial decisions, now in the form of official letters to editors from the Ministry of Internal Security and other verbal “advice”

limiting certain topics, deemed sensitive to the administration, such as race and religion, corruption in the higher echelons, and the secular/Islamic state debate from public discussions through government directives to the media and the public.
The Index by RSF affirms our position that the administration of Abdullah Ahmad Badawi still has a long way to go to realizing its pledge for more openness and transparency. We recommend the following actions be taken immediately to arrest the declining levels of press freedom in the country; set up a parliamentary select committee on media freedom with a view, among others, towards repealing the Printing Presses and the Publications Act 1984, stop Executive interference in editorial decisions
stop using national security laws, such as the Sedition Act, Internal Security Act and Official Secrets Act, which are widely criticized for being extremely broad-worded, against bloggers.

Issued by
Gayathry Venkiteswaran
Executive Director
For more inquiries, please call 03-40230772.

(Unspun, sorry for the OOT, can’t help it, you may delete this if you wish)

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my brain level is at par to ontong lennon mr puki (on Indonesian side) no hurt feeling to you. anyway tq very much for your advise. I think Italian should burn the American Flag,send a protest or bring it international court of justice for having Pizza Hut all over the world!The same thing like one of the Indonesian politician suggested that Rendang,Satay (Sate), Batik is really originally form Indonesian.

Triedtobehonest: Did we say no Malaysian can’t sell rendang, serundeng, batik or satay in Malaysia? No, we did not say it. And I don’t think Italian would mind having Pizza Hut in America because it has popularized Pizza to the whole world but still recognized as the Italian food. Or you just never realized it and always think it was from America all along?

And The Indian goverment should protest to Indonesia for having many aspects of Indonesia’s heritage – like its ever-present symbol of Garuda, the imposing statues of Ganesha or Bhima which stand outside buildings, or the majestic sculpture of horses pulling Arjuna’s chariot in the middle of Jakarta – belong to Hinduism and India?from India’s much richer cultural heritage? Just how would Indonesians feel if they were accused of “stealing”

Triedtobehonest: If you would just read the history book in
Indonesia, you would find out that we never denied the Indian influence in the history of Indonesia. Mind you, they bought us out of the pre-historic age by introduce written language to us.

Am I getting smarter here…

triedtobehonest: i don’t think you’re getting smatter. Getting emotional and irational? yes

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“BTW, what winterinoz said is true that we Indonesians might expressed our disgust on certain things (or certain country) by holding a protest and burning flags, but we don’t go attacking or harrassing the people from that country. You know how many times we burned US or Australian flags? But we don’t harrassed the people of those countries in their daily life in Indonesia. We still respect them as human being, and that is what I heard is lost in the way many Malaysians treat Indonesians. I myself has the experienced being ignored and looked down by Malaysians just because I am Indonesia”

My dear! you are so smart by doing your generalization all Malaysian now at this moment harrasing and attacking Indonesian. Nothing much to do.

Indonesian (most) didn’t know that, to Malaysian “a Malay is a political rather than ethnic definition – a person who practises the customs and culture of the Malays, speaks the language and is a Muslim.”
So, based on ethnic considerations, the majority of Malaysians are in essence Javanese, Bugis, Banjarese, Acehnese, Minangkabaus, Bataks, Makarese, Malukus, Sunda, Bawean, in addition to the Malays from the Riau region.
The roots of these diverse groups are so deep that the languages, dialects and patois are still spoken in enclaves.

And for god sake to certain people “over patrioticsim” understand that the rebublic of Indonesia exist before the Javanese,Bugis,Acehnese,Minangkabaus etc so those tribes who minggle around the maritime is Indonesian since the existance of Adam and Eve. May perhaps Adam and Eve were born some where in Wonogiri or Mojokerto.

Freedom of media ? inclusively free to lie, marketting strategies that 2 million of Indonesian workers in Malaysia been harrased and not been given food to eat at all, all Malaysian including me (dolah kurdis) experienced of knocking down at least one of Indonesian head in Malaysia. And further more my face will automatically change when he or she mentioned oh I am from Indonesia. All Malaysians are arrogant. People will buy those kind of news paper and register as a volunteer to “Ganyang Malaysia” campaign. What a pity.

Again mr Unspun forgive me due to my low iq expression.

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@dolah kurdis
yes yes…

It just proofed my point about you.

@everyone who’s reading this thread
All who agree with me say I……

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Now, now, there is no such thing as Selat Sumatra, it will always be Selat Melaka even for us Indonesian. Not to worry though, we have Selat Sunda, Laut Jawa, Laut Sulawesi, etc. etc…and yes, we once had the ambition to rename Indian Ocean to Indonesian Ocean, but I don’t think it really caught up with general Indonesian public.

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To Kamarul: just read my reply at the beyonce thread.

To Kamarul, you keep on using those word: Indon – indon – indon … do you know that your Minister plan to ban those indon calling because its degrade the true meaning? (an indonesian). However,I also do not agree about myassia calling or truly maling asia, its not the point of the discussion. Malaysia is a good nation, a good country that deserve Indonesians (not Indon) respect. If you want respect from ppl, you should respect others first.

To: Kamarul,
I am quoting bobshowa (myassia):

Lagu Rasa Sayange Direkam di Lokananta
Salah satu bukti kuat bahwa lagu itu merupakan milik Indonesia adalah adanya piringan hitam yang berisi lagu-lagu tersebut yang pertama kali direkam di perusahaan rekaman Lokananta Solo. Lokananta juga masih menyimpan pita real atau rekaman suara sebelum akhirnya dicetak menjadi piringan hitam yang direkam tahun 1962.

Is there any proove that Malaysia already record this Rasa Sayange prior to 1962 ? u always asked Indonesian (not Indon) to proove that Rasa Sayange belongs to nusantara Indonesia. What if you on the other hand, proove that this song originally come from Malaysia ? just because you heard it as a lullaby when you were a baby? oh please …

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huh? going to ban? not yet right? yeah can i know why cant i use indon word? does it has any bad meaning or anything like it? just wondering why uguys seemed to perceived the word…used by many malaysian as degrading

although i dont understand those indon words, im putting it in malay: bukti kukuh bahawa lagu ini milik indonesia ialah piring hitam yang direkod di Lokananta Solo pada tahun 1962, right? now, the first accusation was MTB was stealing the song from indonesia, becoz uguys claimed the song belongs to indonesia, right? indon copyright chief guy said “Bagaimana nak saman Malaysia jika tidak ada siapa yang tahu siapa pencipta lagu itu? Jadi biarlah Malaysia menggunakan lagu itu sebagai lagu tema pelancongan mereka”

as a conclusion, finding the original creator of that song is the sole proof that the song is indonesian…piring hitam cannot disqualified the song as a folksong…when u cannot disqualified the song as a folksong, so u cannot claimed that it is indonesian lah…look at mike’s comment on Bernie Convention above lah…i copy it here so that u read dey…
“However, with the creator of the Rasa Sayang being unknown, and if both countries claim that they have been singing it for centuries simply means that the Rasa Sayang Song has relegated to what is termed as a folk song. For the same reason that you cannot trace the original creators/ songwriters of folk songs, the original writers cannot be identified. As such, one is free to rewrite and rerecord these type songs as they see fit”

why should im the one to proof the song belongs to malaysia, nobody claimed that…so its totally crap!!! to proof that it belongs to nusantara is simply using the proof that indonesia cannot claim the song belongs to them lah

u just dont get it huh pretty??? think more lah rather than being emotional!!! hehe im not cornering u watsoever

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malaysia org malas!! pemaling!! anjing tuh bakar aja!! muka ancur!!! tai lah malaytai tuh!! kita panggil aja sekarang malaysia jd malaytai!!! malaytai~~~!!!!!!!!!!!

Unspun: Er, is this is the best you can do by way of argument disturbia? Lots of spleen but not a single point made. Please down two prozac pills and if pain persists call your doctor. Either muster some arguments and come back to this blog or stand by the roadside shouting at passers-by.

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Reading Kamarul’s…. Saya makin tahu sifat orang Malaysia.

Bangga aku jadi orang Indonesia………..

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Hi Kamarun, just wanna make a quick note on the ”indon” argument thing. Fairy Mahdzan, a malaysian blogger, put it nicely in her blog why indonesian doesn’t like to be called an ”indon”.

http://www.myindo.com/story/241.asp

and also have a look at

http://www.myindo.com/story/241.asp

Peace

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dolah Kurdis : “All those Indonesia doctrine the bottom line is Indonesia never recognize Malacca Strait as “Selat Melaka” it is “Selat Sumatra” under NKRI. Need I say more triedtobehonest?”

@dolah Kurdis : can you show us the map? i never saw any map in indonesia or any map pulished by indonesian publisher shows “selat sumatra” instead of “selat malaka”. As usual malaysian always claimed but cannot prove any fact. Please do not make generalization that all people arround the world have malay character (who really like to claim anything). O.. ya, may be this’s a good news for malaysian that sone malaysian anthroplog claimed that Adam & Eva was Malay… therefore all races in the world are malays too and malaysia has right to claim all cultures in the world as Malay heritages.

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hehe shamsul oh shamsul…its been the 2nd time uve been accusing the wrong person here man…i never said those words lah…go and read above i never said those words…its michael chick who said those words lah

dahlah u wrongly accused me then called me kurang ajar somemore…i demand u withraw ur accusation quickly…i never said those words…im a malay and i dont simply go and degrade my own ppl lah…cheer up man u accused the wrong person here

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@doeljengki: wakaka whats wrong wit this guy really??? hehe he must be having too many good grades in Cambridge exam though…and im sure he did alot of research on whos really scored in those exams hehe…what a joke…i would called u a very respected Cambridge enthusiast…hehe

BTW…whats with “Malay Bumiputra’s”??? got malay nonbumiputra meh??? i dont really get and understand whats the point really…ha now i get it…he must have got this idea when scoring those Cambridge exams with good grades…haha..that really tickles me…what a joke

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@Shamshul Anuar

Yes, I know what you mean when you said not all maids are angel. In fact, my moms maid from the previous semester was so baaaad in attitude and steal some bags and clothes when she returned to her hometown for good.

I took risk management class once, in it, I know there are several ways how people manage their risk. Among them are risk prevention, risk retention, and risk avoidance. If you choose risk prevention, you should do your research before hiring a maid. maybe you should consider insuring your valuables. Risk retention is when you know the risk, but you took it anyway. Its like going to work everyday and passing a really bad neighbourhood that you heard so many people are being mug there. Since the safer way would take longer and you want to work, you took it anyway. And if you choone isk avoidance, then don’t take any maid at all. No maid means no hassle. But of course, you have to work hard cleaning your mess at home and you have to have other caregiver alternatives for your children.

I agree with you, the Indonesian government is not doing enough to improve the quality of indonesian workers. Therefore, they are not getting the same payment and treatment as other nation workers in Malaysia. They should play hard to get a little bit like the Indian and Phillipines Government. It gets their workers the respect, payment, and treatment they deserve.

The Calo is worse, they often lied to the people in rural area to let them take their underage children by promising good money is waiting in Malaysia. If you are underage, of course you have to break the rule in order to get in to malaysia, legally or not. If the did made it working in Malaysia decently, its a miracle. A lot were tricked into prostitution (imagine, underage girls…).

But…all this would come to the ever lasting question: Egg or Chicken, Which come first??? We have the supply, but Malaysia have the demand. Since malaysia is the nearest and have the advantage of similar bahasa melayu, your country would be their first destination. And A lot of malaysia do preffer Indonesian workers because of the language similarity.

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Dear my brother doeljengki
the “claim”word been use by Indonesian and Malaysian government regarding Sipadan and Ligitan. The WORSE thing happens is Malaysia won the trial at the Dan Haag. Your side also do claiming, come on man! be rational. Indonesia’s claim defeated by Malaysia’s claim.
I personally like to say “Indonesia please take that two little tiny Island and develope it” so I as Malaysian won’t get any bad names such as “arrogant”, “Malingsia”, “maling”, what ever it is. This is my humble opinion.

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Just to share the real news about how “bad” we Malaysian is. Especially the Malays huh : (
Bad News is a good news
Secebis kisah manis Katijah (TKW Malaysia yang beruntung)
From Sri Andalas Yogja

Benarkah semua tenaga kerja Indonesia di Malaysia mengalami nasib teruk atau berbuat jinayah?
Saya bukan jenis orang yang suka melebih-lebihkan. Itu terlalu bombastis.
Menurut saya, meskipun seseorang mempunyai 90% sifat buruk, tapi kan masih ada sisa 10% sifat baiknya. Tak Ada Gading Yang Tak Retak bukan?
Saat mencerna kabar berita di Koran, teve atau omongan orang pun saya mencoba untuk berhusnudzan (prasangka baik).

Sebanyak apa jua tenaga kerja yang membuat jinayah (kriminal) di Malaysia, pasti jauh lebih banyak tenaga kerja yang tak macam-macam. Bertungkus lumus mencahari sesuap nasi untuk keluarga di kampung.
Sebaliknya…
Sebanyak apa jua tenaga kerja wanita (amah) yang didera majikannya di Malaysia, pasti banyak juga yang mendapatkan majikan yang baik hati, amanah dan tidak kejam.
Bad News is Good News…ini semboyan wartawan.
Jadi perkara sepele dibesar-besarkan, yang majority macam tak nampak.
Karena laku di jual??? itu pasti!
Cerita berikut adalah suatu kisah manis dan nyata terjadi.
Panggil saja dia Katijah. Usianya baru 27 tahun. Tetapi seperti umumnya perempuan desa, ia kawin muda. Alhasil, Katijah telah punya 2 anak: si sulung 7 tahun dan adiknya 5 tahun.
Katijah adalah penduduk kampung terpencil di daerah Purworejo, Jawa Tengah. Orang miskin dari daerah miskin dan terbelakang. Merantau ke kota adalah pilihan tunggal.

Kebetulan saya memerlukan pembantu di rumah (Bekasi/Jabar), maka saya hubungi kakak di Jogya buat mencarikan pembantu rumah tangga yang mau tinggal di sini dengan gaji sekian sekian.

2 pekan lewat, kakak saya tiba di Jakarta dengan membawa seorang wanita. “Nami kulo Katijah, pak” kata wanita itu. (Nama saya Katijah…)
Semua biasa saja. Dia tak banyak cerita. Sampai suatu hari saat istri saya akan berangkat mengajar (guru taman kanak-kanak), dengan agak terkejut ia bertanya :
“Ibu pernah ke Malaysia ya?”
Istri saya agak bingung, menjawab “Enggak kok, memangnya kenapa?”
“Itu…ibu memakai (baju) kurung Malaysia, saya kira ibu beli saat di Malaysia” katanya…
“Ooh..ini” istri saya melanjutkan “Ini jahitan mama (ibunya) kok, modelnya saja gaya Padang atau Malaysia” menerangkan.

Memang sejak saya menikahinya, tujuh tahun lepas, saya mulai memperkenalkan baju kurung/kebaya melayu gaya padang atau Malaysia ini ke istri saya.
Sekarang, hampir semua bajunya adalah kurung. Tetapi ia tidak menyukai warna-warna yang biasa di pilih wanita Malaysia. “Terlalu cerah…terlalu ramai warnanya” pendapatnya. Karena Syariat lebih menganjurkan warna-warna tenang/gelap.
Tak apalah…selera orang bias aja beda-beda kan?
Jadi ia menggabungkan dengan Batik Jawa (yang cenderung gelap).
Tetap cantik kok. (hehehe…)
Kembali ke Katijah.
Ia lalu bercerita bahwa 6 bulan lepas baru saja kembali dari Malaysia. Menjadi amah/pembantu rumah tangga di Kota Baru, Kelantan.
Sungguh beruntung, Katijah bekerja pada seorang Melayu. Sehingga ia tidak harus mengalami nasib bak Nirmala dan Ceriyati.
4 tahun penuh ia bekerja disitu.

“Majikan saya nih orang kayu bu di Kota Baru, suaminya adalah pemain sepakbola terkenal di Malaysia” (Ada yang tahu…siapa dia? She forgets his name…)
Jadi…saya hampir tak pernah bertemu majikan laki, karena ia selalu bertanding.”

“Saya pun beruntung karena sering diajak keliling Malaysia oleh majikan wanita saya itu, ke pelbagai kota dan tempat pelancongan. Beliau juga gemar berbelanja, dan….nonton konser artis2 Indonesia. Saya diajak nonton konsert Sheila On 7, Kris Dayanti, Peterpan…..”

“Hampir semua….ehm…kebanyakan wanita di Malaysia, terutama di Kelantan memakai kurung bu… dan majikan saya ini hobby-nya jahitin baju kurung. Kalau ditotal –saat pulang kemarin- saya membawa 30 setel kurung pemberiannya. Sebahagian besar udah saya bagi di kampung buat sanak-saudara”

“Saya sungguh senang kerja sama beliau, Cuma makanan saja yang agak bosan. Tiap hari masakan kari belaka. Walau daging dan ikan tapi kalo dibikin kari terus lama-lama kan bosan juga. Jadi saya izin beliau untuk memasak sendiri masakan Jawa. Saya bikin pecel, lodeh, sayur asem, bacem tempe dan tahu. Yang manis-manis pokoknya….Eeeh…rupanya beliau suka juga. Kata beliau, masakan Kelantan pada dasarnya juga manis, hampir seperti masakan Jawa Tengah. Akhirnya, setiap masak kami selang-seling, masakan melayu dan jawa.”

“Empat tahun penuh saya bekerja pada beliau, gaji saya terbayar penuh. Saya bebas beribadah, menonton teve. Segala hal. Tetapi, rasa rindu terhadap anak-anak saya lebih hebat. Maka saya putuskan untuk kembali dulu ke kampung, mengobati rasa rindu. Beliau sangat sedih. Tetapi ia tak boleh menahan saya. Berulang kali ia menawarkan kenaikan gaji tapi wajah si cilik lebih menarik dari uang berapa ribu ringgit pun. Majikan saya akhirnya melepas saya dengan berkali-kali berpesan : Jika dah puas, engkau harus balik lagi kerja di rumah ibu, di Kota Baru.”

Akhirnya saya kembali ke kampung.
Kini, 6 bulan sudah, rindu saya telah terobati… tetapi rasanya Kota Baru terlalu jauh untuk saya datangi lagi. Saya tidak sanggup lagi.

Demikianlah…
Sungguh beruntung Katijah.
Kisahnya indah buat diceritakan, indah buat dikenang.
Dan saya yakin beribu-ribu Katijah lainnya diluar sana juga mengalaminya.
Sayang….semua itu tak pernah terceritakan,
tertelan berita buruk si Nirmala Bonat & Ceriyati.
Bad News is Good News

Seperti halnya beribu-ribu tenaga kerja pria lainnya
Yang kisah manis dan jasanya tak pernah terungkapkan.
Melainkan segelintir yang menjinayah dan memecah rumah..
Yang buruk-buruk itu bagus buat dijual.
Sungguh laku untuk dijual..
Lagi
Bad News is Good News

Sayang….

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@doeljengki: hehe ur comment oso like typical indon comment lah…putting some info wit the hope that it will connect wit the rasa sayange issue…but at the end i dont see any leading point??? obviously trying to make malays in malaysia looks bad in such way…but the glaring point im stating here…THIS CAMBRIDGE PROFESSOR doesnt know with all his good grades to prove that the song really belongs to indons properly

BTW, letme tell u the academic system in malaysia!!! like shamsul said, thanks to the govern for the NEP lah…most of malays good student stayed in local public universities…while all those brilliant nonmalays student , due to lack of places in local public universities, they spend their own money going outside lah

in universities, if u go lah u can get two groups of malaysian student, most malays who are a year younger from matriculation program and most nonmalays who are a year older from STPM program…although both programs are preuniversity program, but STPM is 5 times harder which produces better quality of students (whose mostly nonmalays)…not to mention chinese which i really admire them due to their hardworking habit

got it, cambridge prof??? now, why dont u argue with me what is the point behind this to prove that the rasa sayange song belongs to Indons??? hopefully u can answer properly and pls dont do the simple mistake like running away and not answering the Q…after all ur the Cambridge prof right??? noway u can do such a silly mistake…hehe(i hope) 😉

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Dear DoelJengki.

I refer to your remarks. Actually Malaysians are proud of the achievements of Malaysians who achieved excellent grades in academic field, be it local or foreign universities.

The race factor is irrelevant here. I mean no disrespect to you but what actually you achieved by ridiculing others. I believe the more positive attitudes is to look into how you can help Indonesia( your beloved country) in many various ways. Putting down others does not do you any goods.

Recently part of Sumatera was badly hit by earthquake. Hei. I have an idea. Why dont you spend more time to gather funds to help them. I am sure you have ample time, jugding from your meaningless ranting about others.

They say those who lose a character lose everything. May sanity prevail. May hatred be removed from our mortal heart.

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@doeljengki: hehe me wrong??? of course im always wrong lah, ur the Cambridge professor, ur always right…anyway i will just use ur words back here…how typical indon, just run away from answering the Qs…dahlah main sondol je bagi proofs and all…at the end proof doesnot make any sense at all lah…how come Cambridge prof got so low thinking like this…now i doubt of ur good grades over there

hey Camb prof, letme tell u this, even this simple thing oso u cant think huh, what kind of prof r u really? my explaination of the malaysian educational system above had aledy make ur proof like craplah and useless…u cant get good malay students outside the country while the best nonmalay students are there…of courselah u can see these ppl there at cambridge…my point is u cant use this proof tosay that malay students cannot achieve at par with nonmalay students…im a student, i know lah, what are u? but of courselah, quantity wise, chinese students are very good…

this proof of urs should buang into laut sumatera aledy lah…that dolah kurdis guy(thanx to him) aledy tell u this laut sumatera crap being claimed in UUD45,Penataran P4 pola 100 Jam, Kewiraan, Ilmu Sosial Dasar,PMKI…why are u so like cannot think one huh? its even wrong for uguys to state it here and then ur asking for map somemore??? what a total mess…hehe act like Cambridge prof konon…

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Fact 1: Malay in Malaysia context is a word coined by Malaysian government for it’s own propaganda (please refer again, and again, the above and all the Rasa threads on what’s the Malaysian gov definition) — Malays are Malaysian but Malaysian may not be Malays.

Fact 2: A song that has been composed more than 50years can be used by anyone in his/her own version and folklore can’t be claimed by anybody or country. — It is nice to know where it’s from now but that doesn’t change a thing. If let’s say a Maluku (sorry if I spelled wrongly) decendent in Malaysia used it to promote his new adopted country, he’s not stealing right? So how sure are we that there are no Maraukus in Malaysia???

Fact 3: Dear Kamarul, since people don’t like to be called Indon, please respect that. If I tell you Malay is a degorative term, would you still like me to call you that????

Fact 4: Malay languange has been widely used in this region in the old world and known to the then powerful western world, so basically all ethnic people in ths region, including Philipines, Malaysia, Indonesia and Singapore are known as Malays — so by calling names to Malays is just like calling names to yourself, unless your ancesters were not from this region. (Pardon me ah, I don’t have any documents to support this claim one)

Fact 6: The Western world known this region when Malacca was famous and maybe that’s why it’s known as Straits of Malacca since the earliest found map. Unless you can produce an older map to show that it was Selat Sumatra than you can fight for the change of name in the international court. BUt I think that the word Sumatra doesn’t even exist then, maybe it should be selat Acheh? or Selat Srivijaya? (Pardon me again ah, no docs for this)

Fact 7: (especially Shamshul anuar) Don’t ever believe everything in your textbooks. You may find many question asked may not be answerable by your school teachers. I had plenty such experience myself. How many years we were thought in textbooks that 513 is a racial initiated event – have you read the book May 13? BTW, those who challenged Malaysian Malays academic achievements, could any Indonesian name some themselves. Anyway, it’s meaningless.

Fact 8: Being Patriotic is good but there are more civilised ways to demonstrate that. People respect rational dicussion and not emotional arguments. Freedom of speech is important but certain balance must be made. You burn my flag I burn yours and what’s next? We start shooting at each other? Is that the freedom that you want? In exchange for chaos???

Fact 9: Dear Indonesia friends, you are not happy the way some Malaysian treats Indonesian. Have you looked into yourself 10years back how you have treated the Chinese, dare I say it’s worst? In Malaysia, just a fraction of people behaved like that, they behaved like that to everyone actually, including Malaysian from other states or ethnic. Do please get your facts right. By the same notion, China should have taken military action against Indonesia 10yrs back. Also, you can’t deny that many in this problematic group has ancesters from the Indonesian islands, they may share your ancesters. So are you not actually cursing yourselves?

Fact 10: This thread is getting too far stretched from it’s original discussion and getting less productive. Dear all, if you want to state your argument point, you don’t have to add any emotional quote and name calling. It starts to sound like catfight.

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Dear Kang Kombor.

I refer to your remarks. It is one thing to be patriotic. It it however another story to be paranoid. What you have got to lose by visiting Malaysia? They say travelling widens the horizon. Obviously, you do not subscribe to that wise saying.

What is it with preoccupation with batik, satay. Batik is well known in both Malaysia and Indonesia. Are you saying Malaysia must stops its thriving batik industry simply because Indonesia claims ownership of batik. And satay is very delicious, transcending cultural boundary.

Are you saying Malaysians can not eat satay simply because Indonesia claims satay originates from Indonesia. It does not matter who created satay . It does not matter whether the creator of such a tempting delicacy was born in Indonesia, Malaysia or Tanzania or Sri Lanka.

I may be critical of many Indonesian politicians who play to the gallery just to promote their self interest. But I am not paranoid. I still visit Indonesia when I have the time.

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@Shamsul: im a malaysian malay, im not happy not only with malaysian govern’s policy on the foreign immigrant issue…but im more unhappy with the NEP, AUKU, our democracy level, freedom of expression etc

about May 13, i wondered when Dr.Kua first published the book about it, as u accused, is there any violent protest being stoked? any racial tension about it? anybody dead becoz of it? Theres not only chinese, indians and others who supported the untold story of May 13 being published, theres oso malays there…

now what is my point here?? The only reason we want to korek balik the May 13 untold story and The only reason im sure that u will NEVER admit is that we wanted to tell the ppl, whos really behind May 13?, who started the racial tension? who benefited alot from May 13? was it really racial tension or theres a political(UMNO) role behind it?? Hehe of course the best way for UMNO to scare away the ppl from listening, to cover up their secrets and role on May 13 is by accusing Dr.Kua of stoking racial tension…

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hello my brother Vic.KyleEllane thank you. I hope you are Indonesian like mr kemsey fella hopefully there are more people like you. Ok I just agree to your fact no1 and no.2.
Fact no.7 do not believe everything in text book well since I proofed two books written by Indonesian and published in Indonesia,they ask for a map? I dont want to use books from other countries especially Malaysia since its all lies to some Indonesian he he he but as a Malaysian I cannot choose the place to be borned peace for every body. Ok

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quoting kamarul:
“secondly, i do respect my fellow indonesians, if u looked at any of my comments, is there anything that i said to purposely degrading the indonesians?”

@kamarul:
Bravo, you could keep on using the word ‘indonesian’. You may consider that indon is only a jargon, but if it is hurting other people feeling, then it is not a good one and you may tolerate it. According to detik.com now there is a new jargon from one of m’sia’s house of reps member: “mat indon”

quoting kamarul:
on the “indon” issue, its a malaysian jargon, its malaysian language…as far as i know it doesnot have any bad meaning…

@kamarul
please go to this link:

http://www.utusan.com.my/utusan/archive.asp?y=2004&dt=0722&pub=utusan_malaysia&sec=rencana&pg=re_05.htm&arc=hive

and this, our Minister has express official protest to malaysia government about the using of word indon toward indonesians:

http://www.detiknews.com/index.php/detik.read/tahun/2007/bulan/05/tgl/13/time/130005/idnews/780073/idkanal/10

and link from winterinoz:

http://fairy.mahdzan.com/story/241.asp and http://fairy.mahdzan.com/story/240.asp

@kamarul, I hope you will understand.

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ya sudahlah bagi-bagi aja……… gitu aja koq repot :p

toh lagunya juga tidak sama persis kan…… malaysia punya versi sendiri, INDO (please dun say indon! sounds rude) juga punya versi sendiri…. anggap saja berasal dari sumber yang sama….

there’s no way to prove that rasa sayange is Indo’s song nor Malaysian’s….. we both feels that one’s right and other’s wrong…… but no one really knows, since there’s no witness at the time the song was made, is it?

stay calm n peace……!

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I think this Rasa Sayang controversy is truly an example of the aftermath of divide and rule. And many of us just fall flat into it. Maki hamun each other, when the real issue is Indonesia and Malaysia were separated by artificial boundaries by the British and Dutch. Rasa Sayang is a beloved song that belongs to this Nusantara and is sung by many of us in the region.

Following my father’s line, I am a 4th generasi Chinese, following my mother’s, I am Burmese mix Baba Nonya. I grew up singing this song like it belongs to my own culture. Now I read somewhere it came from Ambon.
When I went overseas to study and was asked to share a local song, I sang Rasa Sayang, Feelings of Love, and I explained to them that Malay has three words to say love – kasih, cinta and sayang. And they’re amazed.

I think it’s silly to fight over the rightful owner of this song and demand royalties over it. Recognition, yes, and I think Malaysia should emphasise that this beautiful and simple song belongs to the Malay archipelago that encompasses Indonesia and Malaysia, though its real origins of it’s composer have possibly been lost in the ashes of time.

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just to comment on the use of Indon word.

THe country’s name is Indonesia
The people are called Indonesian (s)

Just like Malaysia and Malaysian(s).
We don’t go around calling you Malas, kan.

Thanks.

BTW, peterpan, sheila on 7, ungu,radja,slank, krisdayanti, and all of our B-rated sinetron artists say hi to their loyal – hysterical fans in Malaysia.

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nice zakrul…after reading the posts in that blog…now i even has a 50-50 thinking that the Rasa Sayang hey is not even originated from Maluku.
the malaysian version has HEY ends, oso in taiwan and hong kong versions. but only in Maluku got e’ ends

maybe its Rasa Sayang hey first, then Rasa Sayange or the otherwise…who knows…mayb due to its e’ ends in Maluku version make those indonesians confident enough that the song is actually from Maluku

hopefully somebody can find out about this, which one is the original 🙂

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@gadisbintang: TTTTTTTAAAAAAAAAAAAKKKKKKKK NNNNNAAAAAAKKKKKK! Sampai bila2 pun taknak…sebab? kurang bijak…titik 🙂 hehe

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@shamsul: what do u mean by “If I am just going to depend on your attitude, Kamarul, “habislah”.” i dont get it…anyway can i ask u to withdraw ur accusation that im the one who came up with the words “dirt ass poor”

Dr.Kua 513, he did go and find a malay leader on this issue. that prof whatever, i forgot his name. Hes one of malay leader of an organization at that time…he did gave a speech at the lauching ceremony…

and please shamsul…what i see from Dr.Kua, its not important whether i agree with him onot, i may or may not. but what i see is hes trying to korek balik the untold story based on political spectrum…what u and some others is branding the political spectrum of his into a racial thing

remember not all malays are UMNO, so when he talks about UMNO hes not talking about malays…dont we malays pretend lah that we dont stoke racial tension…the best evidence is Kursus tatanegara, everybody knows…and if u dont admit this, im gonna tell this story here with all the details…

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eh another missing thing…um no offense ya but i got this, although u denied that ur a racist but ur views and stands seemed to me that ur one…no offense

anyway…if unspun really interested in opening another thread on this NEP policy and May 13 so that our indonesian counterparts can see whats really happening in malaysia…i would appreciate it very much. dont want this to hijack this thread… 🙂

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if anyone still need further proof, search ” rasa sayange” on youtube.com. On the list, you will find a very old version of the song. It was in a Dutch film around 1937-1940.

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@widya and triedtobehonest: i do get ur points, again i want to bring about the Bernie Convention, the only problem that we have here is that by proving that the song originated from Maluku donot grant us the right to say that the song belongs to Indonesia. to say that the song belongs to Indonesia, we must declassified it as folksong, as folksong can never be claimed by any nation, it can be used by any nation that shared the same heritage, by any means she likes, without any prior notice to anyone.

the only way to declassified it as a folksong is to find the writer of this song. what i know( as i donot know much 🙂 ) by proving the arrangement and the version it being used in a Dutch film long2 ago, is just to prove that it originated from Maluku, didnt prove it belongs to Indonesia. right? 😀

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Koppig…koppeg…koplok! need I say more?

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Dear kamarul.

Many thanks for your response. I read your view with regards to May 13. “Habislah”, simply means that what a tragedy for Malays to embrace should their leader just simply adopts your attitude.

With ease you imply that May 13 actually was a power struggle . Put it clearly, what people like you or Kua believed that May 13 was actually planned by some UMNO leaders to achieve their objective. Correct me if I am wrong, was that what you meant with the demeaning laugh, he , he” in your previous comment.

I still remember how a shop owner in 1986 who opened a stationery shop in Damansara Utama told my university professor ( American , of course they do not know much about the racial clash) what you or Kua recently implied. I asked him a simple question about a DAP procession that happened during the period on which sadly Malays were provoked to the extreme. His face turn red. He was unable to answer me.

Kamarul, jugding from your remarks, I assume you do not know much about May 13. Perhaps, you should take a trip down memory lane to get an objective view with regards to May 13. Ask around Malays in 50s to 60s. They will tell you the story, you know story that of course you will not get from Kua.

I vouched on what I said. I have many living proof on this sad incident. All of them said one thing. How severely the patience of Malays were tested to the limit by extremists including those from DAP. I do not know how old are you. If you are 50s and above, you will agree to me. If you are younger, well just ask around and you will be surprise to listen how far Kua’s assesment from the truth.

ThankGod, I appreciate several Malay leaders for their gut in telling the truth about May 13. Hence, my remarks , “habislah” if they also adopt your attitude. You know the pathetic attitude of looking down your own race as if they have done nothing good.

The reason why Malays were not that keen to discuss May 13 is very simple. They simply do not wish to offend the Chinese community as it involved extremism from that community. Not everybody can accept the truth. Not everybody can be as calm as a Malay if he or she finds that somehow element of his race is implicated.

Malays reluctance to discuss May 13 is not due to being afraid of the truth. Rather, being Malay character, they realize that a good intention can be deadly if it is out of hand. Why reopen the old wound. Healing itself takes a long time. Why create another problem simply because someone from DAP tries to show that he is the champion of his community.

Again, I have to reiterate that I am not anti Chinese . I simply put the facts on the table. Facts that I gathered myself , not entirely from officialdom as of course people like will not believe it . Facts I got from expolicemen, villagers, housewife, office workers, religious leaders.

And for once, you are right. Not all Malays are UMNO member. I am not an UMNO member. And I never deny extremism in Malay community, just like That I am aware about extremism in Chinese community.

And you are wrong in saying that I reject any move “to korek balik” about May 13. What I( and majority of Malays, excluding you of course) reject is the tendency to put the blame on Malay leaders . They call a spade a spade. It is racial as Kua put the blame on the Malays. It is a racial thing as Kua himself is a racist , at least that is what malays feel.

As for Kursus Tatanegara, enlighten the public and authority if racial card is played here. And do also enlighten Kua about how Malays feel everyday when pass along Jalan Maharajalela when Dewan Perniaggan Cina building published the number of days a Chinese school was closed( actually relocated to fulfill wishes of Chinese community but DAP again played the racial card).

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http://www.antara.co.id/arc/2007/10/3/lagu-kebangsaan-malaysia-diduga-jiplakan-lagu-indonesia/

camner kitorang msia?
lagu rasmi negara kite jer hasil duplikasi

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@shamsul: maybe i dont know much about May 13 as im only in my early 20s. the point here is that the younger generation like us donot really know much about it especially when the govern donot encourage ppl about it. in my opinion, if we have prob, why dont we sit and talk about it, avoid using emotional inflammatory provocations. of course u will say its not easy, but hey its not impossible

i do realized both malays/chinese sides did suffered alot during that time. u can go on saying all of those emotional inflammatory provocations but i really dont see something good coming out of it. i do see alot of explanations from Dr.Kua and Prof Syed Hussin (hes a malay) if im not mistaken. i dont see any of their comments to be racist, they donot blame any race either malays or chinese, not to mention emotional. whats they are talking about is what really happened that bring about the racial clashes? what the meeting in the Selangor MB resident is all about?? u know this meeting even occurred before the clashes. the UMNO govern did lose the election at that time, and when this thing happened, the elections result was canceled. did UMNO used this to maintain in power?? now i really hated u for calling me degrading my own race. i may/maynot agree with Dr.Kua but these Qs should be answered by UMNO.

again i tell u, even though mayb ur older than me. i really HATED that u called me to be degrading my own race. the fact that i asked the UMNO leaders to answer these Qs donot means that im degrading my own race!!! thats the simple trick that ppl like u shamsul tried to impose to others who questioned UMNO leaders, “Pengkhianat Melayu”!!! That is ssssoooo damn bad. at least i know which is right or wrong regardless of racial entity, whoever did wrong must be punished. the way u talked, im really sure that u dont k have any idea what we the younger generations think about May 13. the fact that UMNO continues to zip their mouth about this and sweep the dirt under the carpets, more opposition figures talked about this thing, the more anti-UMNO sentiment will build up among malay younger generation whether u like onot!!!! Not to mentioned AUKU etc, UMNO will be brought down soon or later, that im sure about…. 😀

anyway…do u support the formation a royal commission to investigate on May 13? 😀

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Dear kamarul.

Many thanks for your response. It shows you are concerned about May 13. Only that you are misled. That is all.

Do not personal, young man. You are still young. Only I hope you check your fact before talking. Obviously reading your comment makes me realized that you do not know much about May 13.

As for meeting at the residence of Selangor Menteri Besar, are you saying Datuk Harun Idris plotted the racial clash? It is normal for for leaders or assemblymen to assemble a the head of govt’s house during election. What is so strange with that.

And do check your fact. UMNO did not lose the election. UMNO and Barisan fared quite badly in the ellection. MCA was wiped out in Penang, the saving grace being UMNO holding the fort for Barisan. The result in Selangor showed no party held a majority. aND who said the election result was cancelled. Please enlighten me and the world, young man.

This part is the part that you of course did not know. Did you know of a DAP procession that turned ugly where they mocked the Malays? Did you? Why dont you asked your parents.

Did Kua asked the opinions of Malays including that of UMNO. You know, he is from DAP, a party that has wishes totally againsts that of Malays. Do you think Malays believe it. Except you of course as you are ignorant of history.

Call a spade a spade they say. After condemning and insinuating your own race, you are upset when someone older advised you. Contrary to what you feel, UMNO never said anything about hiding the truth. UMNO encourages Malaysians to know the truth, But as the dominant political party that determines the future as it receives the mandate, UMNO is obligated to ensure that seeking truth does not turn into blaming session.

Young people like you who never experienced seeing your own brother killed before your own eyes due to racial clash of course feel nothing about playing with fire. Malaysians should be thankful that at least UMNO leaders then and today are not vengeful. It did not publicly blamed DAP although it has all the evidences. It is just a Malay character. No need to open the old wound.

It did not blame any race. Rather it tried to make racial integration a success. It is hard to do a balancing act. On one side you have a large section of population was under poverty then . On the other side you have a section of population that controls the economy, demanding the govt to stop so called “special privelleges” to the bumiputera but they themselves stay put in private sector with “speaking Mandarin is required” mentality.

I am not saying that Malays or UMNO or any political party do not make mistakes. They did and some still doing it. We are after all human. But UMNO does deliver. A class of professional bumiputera exists nowadays because of UMNOs policy. Yet many Malays feel that no need of them to be appreciative although without policy of the govt( meaning UMNO initiated policy) they until today will never set their foot in aeroplanes, let alone studying in UK, USA.

Kamarul, you condemned UMNO but fail to realize that the only that stand between DAP and getting to Malays is UMNO. Imagine even DAP had yet to assume power, its members mocked Malays during May 13. Just imagine what would they do if they assume power.

As for royal Commission on May 13, I am not for it although I am not against it. But are you prepared to accept the evidences that Malays have vs DAP( not vs Chinese) . Are you prepared the reality that not everybody can accept the truth calmly the way Malays did. If I were to be the PM, I will not estabish the commision that it will only reopen the old wound. Maybe you are too young to understand.

Contrary to what you feel, UMNO is not against people wanting to know the truth. it is however wants to make sure that the concern is genuine, not the type that Kua presented that played the racial gallery under the guise of wanting to know the truth.

And actually you can have the truth. But first, discard the the mentality that make you feel great to insinuate your own race albeit you did it of course naively. Open your eyes, open your heart. Remove the hatred and seeking the truth is easier.

And do remember, for some magazines and powers to be on the other side of Suez Canal , being a Malay and Muslim will automatically make you the guilty party. To them whatever policy that promotes the interests of Malays is bad.

There are bad elements and good ones anywhere in UMNO and other parties. Some UMNO assemblymen are morons. So do some polticians from the other side of divides. I accept criticism. What I or any Malay worth his or her salt reject is the mentality that it is trendy to insult or mock ( you know the word He, he) his own race not because the race is guilty but because the colonial mentality that being Malay means that you must be the guilty party.

You know not everyone is “merdeka”. By the way, have you tried asking DAP about the procession that turned ugly. Why not ask KUa. He seems to jugde people a lot. Why not ask him about DAP’s role here. Surely he can give an answer. I dare you.

Again, I have to repeat that I never blame Malay or Chinese on May 13. May all Malaysians learn from this tragedy. And my last advice is have you asked your parents about May 13. Just ask.

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My Information to all the debaters….

1. Nusantara adalah sebuah kata yang pertama kali diciptakan oleh Tokoh Besar Soekarno (Presiden pertama Indonesia) untuk melukiskan negaranya yaitu Indonesia. Adalah akronim dari NUSA (Pulau) dan ANTARA. Nusantara artinya Kepulauan yang berada di antara dua Benua (Asia dan Australia) dan di antara dua Samudera (Hindia dan Pasifik). Indonesia adalah yang dimaksud Soekarno degan Nusantara. Malaysia bukan Nusantara, karena masih berada di benua Asia. Singapura mungkin masih bisa disebut Nusantara, tapi sepertinya bukan Singapura yang dimaksud saat Soekarno mengatakan ingin menyatukan Nusantara.

2. Malaysia mengaku BATIK adalah berasal dari Malaysia. Tapi di situs kerajaan malaysia sendiri, mereka mengakui kalau batik itu berasal dari Indonesia (Jawa). Baca:
http://malaysiana.pnm.my/04/0402batik.htm

3.Malaysia pun mengaku KERIS berasal dari Malaysia. Tapi di situs tersebut pun ternyata, terdapat lebih banyak gambar keris dari INDONESIA dari pada keris MALAYSIA. Baca:
http://malaysiana.pnm.my/05/0504keris_hulu.html

4.Malaysia mengaku juga ANGKLUNG berasal dari Malaysia. Coba tanyakan sama para ahli Angklung MAyasia, dari mana mereka belajar Angklung? Mereka semua belajar di BANDUNG Indonesia.

5.Mari Orang2 Indonesia, minta dengan TVRI dokumen rekaman acara TITIAN MUHIBAH, dimana lagu tersebut sering dinyanyikan bersama (disana para artis Malaysia menyayikan lagu Rasa Sayange dengan teks di tangan mereka). Orang2 Malaysia pun boleh minta dokumen acara tersebut kepada RTM atau TV3 (Saya lupa yang mana).

6. Indonesia punya lebih dari 50.000 lagu daerah yang populer dan lebih banyak lagi yang tidak populer ke seluruh NUSANTARA. Rasanya Indonesia menggugat Malaysia bukan karena “mencuri” 1 lagu yang secara kalkulatif tidak ada artinya, tapi karena Malaysia sudah tidak menghormati lagi Indonesia sebagai ‘saudara serumpun’nya.

7.Pemerintah Indonesia segera mendaftarkan hasil karya anak bangsanya.

Lagu lagu seperti Bungong Jeumpa,Badindin,Kebile-Bile,Jali-Jali,Manuk Dadali,O Ina ni Keke, dll

Tari-tarian seperti Saman, Seudati,Tanggai,Kecak,dll

Makanan seperti Rendang, pempek, rawon, pecel, rujak,soto,coto, dll

Kerajinan tekstil seperti songket,ulos,tenun ikat,dll.

Tradisi seperti pencak silat, debus, ondel ondel dll

Agar kejadian “The Rasa Not So Sayang” tidak terjadi lagi.
Kepada rakyat Malaysia, Selamat menikmati kemakmuranmu!

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To Shamsul and others, the May 13 discussion is over here
https://theunspunblog.com/2007/10/28/readers-request-may-13/

i had put up some view of mine about Dr.Kua’s book and the declassified documents released by British High Commission on May 13 coup d’etat. maybe im ignorant of history and so as accused by Shamsul but I found no reason to disbelieve those dispatches…

really, i dont understand u shamsul, ive aledy stated that i hated u to call me that. in such way that ive aledy told u, u continued to do so. i do respect u maybe due to ur older than me(?) but could u give me some respect by not doing something that i hated. anyway u cleverly didnot substantiate on it, feeling that UMNO leaders are not doing a good job does NOT means im degrading my own race…cut the crap and nagging aledy…btw DONOT cont our discussion on May 13 here, pls use the link above…

@Tommy Joe: im so sorry becoz u had a total misunderstanding on wayang. wayang is cinema, it has different meaning with movie/film coz u can even watch movie/film through tv/pc/vcd. shadow puppets in malaysia is called wayang kulit (pls dont ask why, i dont know lah 🙂 ). Nusantara is actually being created by Soekarno? are u sure? im not a language specialist etc so why dont u help me by putting some facts on it? Thanx…

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@Tommy Joe: Tambahan tentang terminologi NUSANTARA (seperti sudah saya terangkan diatas) adalah betul diciptakan oleh Soekarno.

im really sorry, cant help it. u said u aledy explained it. can i know where is it? i didnt say ia dtg dr kosakata melayu, sy juga tak cakap yg ianya tidak dtg dari kosakata bahasa indonesia, sy juga tidak kata ianya tidak diciptakan oleh Soekarno…the only person that came up with this in the first place is u

since ur the first to came up with this (which i dont deny) and u aledy said that u aledy explained it…so why dont u show it to me where is ur explanation????…im not so clever and i dont have the supernatural power to understand whats in ur mind unless u explained to me lah

uve got to be kidding me, even this simple thing oso u wanna argue with me lah…explanation please??? cheers man 🙂

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come on Tmmy Joe! you swallow everythings you get from your own Indonesian version kind of definition about things..kenapa tidak banyak orang indonesia seperti Vic.Kyle,Kemsey, come on man! I am about to stop now you really make me come back with your narrow minded. It never cross your mind that Malaysia consist of Bugis,Minang,Jawa,Melayu,Banjar,Bawaean,Arab,India,Chinese,Japanese, so so narrow monded you are. This people were here since there are Indonesia or Malaysia. If you want to argue here dont bring up your high school kind of text books.

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Hi Michael, fair comments based on proflound knowledge. I wish your people were like you. UMNO’s control over media and indoctrination really work. Can you suggest your people to learn from Datok Anwar Ibrahim?

I wish your people refer to other source of knowledge than the HIS story provided by your regime. Malaysians, Put yourselves in universal perspective and see how you contribute to the world. That’s how you should honor yourselves.

Fellow Indonesian, let’s learn and work together to transform Indonesia anew.

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Sepertinya, bangsa rumpun melayu gemar membajak. Pemerintah Malaysia dan Indonesia perlu bekerja keras untuk mendisiplinkan bangsa masing-masing.

Masyarakat Indonesia gemar membajak lagu India, lagu Mandarin, software komputer Amerika; sedang Malaysia gemar membajak budaya tradisional Indonesia.

Indonesia (240 juta) + Malaysia (24 juta) = 264 juta, we are the great nations… kalau tidak segera bersatu, tidak mungkin segera menandingi peradaban Barat, Tiongkok, Asia Timur, dan India.

Rasa sayange, rasa sayang sayange …

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@dolah kurdis: is it true that Tommy Joe was quoting from those textbooks?
Kamarul,
Yes, In fact I suspected he uses a primery or secondary school text book. Vic.Kyle already said those are the propaganda of the people who rule at that time. i agreed with that. I do not deny that Malaysia also has her own propaganda.

If he is not a norrow minded he wont used the term dan definiton according to his beloved Sukarno. I dont want to argue about Sukarno (good bless upon him) definition of Nusantara since he’s no longer exist in this world!

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u want my medical view on ethics huh? ethics is so subjective, it is so complex that we cannot define exactly what it is…in medical, ethical issues are always interpreted based on medicolegality. ethical guidelines are only used within the nation, if we wanted to settle international issues, we go by medicolegality…even within a nation, the interpretation of ethics are not the same ie different ethnics and cultures…

examples: euthanasia in western and eastern nations differ greatly. if indonesia said its unethical to steals, malaysian said its unethical to fitnah others stealing if we dont have the proof…this is very subjective and we cannot solve problems based on either one, becoz it doesnt applied to the other…so thats why we go by legality, its more objective…

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“if indonesia said its unethical to steals, malaysian said its unethical to fitnah others stealing if we dont have the proof…this is very subjective and we cannot solve problems based on either one, becoz it doesnt applied to the other…”

Kamarul bro! you have proofed your points. Congratulations !

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thanx dolah Kurdis and Pretty, im just being argumentative, i really know nothing in the first place…

@triedtobehonest: u still dont understand my point. how we interpret ethical issues are different in different nations…indonesia may perceived stealing is bad, but malaysian perceived fitnah (by not proving ur accusation) even worse, (most malaysians are religiously conservative esp muslims, in Islam it even said that fitnah is even worse than killing, so this view of malaysians i think probably contributed by Islam, correct me if im mistaken)

my point is when theres an international issue, we cannot look at the issue based on certain nation’s view. why? becoz the other will never accept it. the best way to go is through the legal system. im not saying stealing is not wrong and we are not living in stone age either… 🙂

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Hi moderator,

Could you redirect the discussion to the main points?

Nevertheless, It helps me understand my neigbour

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I actually hate this kind of arguments, but this is my 2 cents, anyway.

I think it is safe for me to assume this, from my empirical experiences (since i live in several malay populated areas in indonesia throughout my life),
no indonesian malays DARE to claim that the song is from malayan heritage. anybody from any ethnic in indonesia can firmly confirm that the song is from mollucan heritage only by the lyrics and tunes…

Indonesian malays have more pride to their own true heritage than claiming the obviously eastern-indonesia-influenced tunes and lyrics.

I was born from a small town called mempawah in west borneo, and even in just that 1 town only, the malay culture is so full, rich, and exquisite, many many songs and cultural creativities are owned by that town’s malay populations, and some of them even make me proud that i was born in that town, even if im a bataknese,

heck, in many occasions i still sing “sebukit rama” and “galaherang” along with my own ethnic folksongs “butet” or “tano batak”.

and i havent talk about pontianak malays, or riau malays, and even medan malays…

to claim that ‘the song’ originated from malay culture is an insult to the creativities of malay people.

Malay ethnic(s) already has a rich culture, have pride in it, why claim other ethnic’s folksongs, no matter how beautiful they are?

i understand that you might think it is not really that important, but try to see things in our perpective here (or at least my perspective),

many indonesians are proud of our diverse cultural heritage, but even then we wouldnt try to claim them all to 1 cultural singularity.

The malaysian claim to that song hurt the hearts of both indonesian malays and the mollucans.

Unspun: Those are very good points Bonar. Very fresh insights of Indonesian Malays that I had not even considered. Thank you. Would love to have a chat with you some day in the lapo 🙂

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My words are lost! Could unspun find them for me?

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@dolah Kurdis: coz we argue to find solutions. by doing so we will never find one…and the solution is all that matter, and we need it quick, fast, precise and can satisfy most (not all, coz never will) 🙂

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@triedtobehonest: jewish is religion? what about Judaism? a race? anyway have u find out the definitions of religion and faith? Coz obviously u donot know what are they…

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A-HA! I spot another classification error. There are only 2 “races” in the world defined by a religion. The “Jews” and the “Malays”. To set the record straight; Judaism is a religion, while Jews refer to the Israelites. Therefore, it is not technically correct to call Prophet Mohamed as a Jew, because he is an Israelite. He is a descendant of Moses.

When we speak of the Christian “Jews” and the Hindu “Malays”, or the Indian Muslims, we refer to their religion as separate from their “race” or nationality. And the two are not really the same. Just like Angeline Jolie is described as a Buddhist American (or now, Cambodian). And therefore the two can NEVER be the same. As much as most people assume that “Malays” are Muslim, for lack of understanding.

On the same line-of-thought, it is just as bad to say that ALL MUSLIMS are SUICIDE BOMBERS. See how ridiculously wrong information can be?

I really abhor pre-conceived ideas on stereotyping. It causes confusion as well as creates extremely bad “blood” and animosities.

Truly Asia Boleh 🙂

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Wah, ini sih kalau nggak distop nggak akan ada habisnya. Namanya juga api dalam sekam, dikipasi sedikit langsung nyala. Mudah-mudahan komentar-komentar yang ada di sini dapat menjadi masukan bagi masing-masing pihak – warga Indonesia dan Malaysia. Saya sendiri jadi paham bahwa tidak sepenuhnya kedua belah pihak salah dan juga tidak sepenuhnya kedua belah pihak benar.

Dalam hal lagu Rasa Sayange, saya pikir-pikir, toh lagu yang dipakai pemerintah Malaysia dalam kampanye pariwisatanya adalah Rasa Sayang, bukan Rasa Sayange. Bukan berarti bangsa Indonesia kehilangan lagu itu kan, karena yang kita miliki dan dapat kita tunjukkan ke dunia adalah lagu Rasa Sayange. Kedengarannya sama, tapi rasanya tentu beda. Seperti makan Indomie yang dijual di Indonesia dan yang dijual di Malaysia – nama barang boleh sama, kurang lebih (soalnya saya belum pernah lihat produk yang dijual di Malaysia; Apa yang saya nyatakan lebih didasarkan pada komentar mereka yang sudah pernah mengonsumsinya), tapi rasanya (katanya) berbeda jauh.

Hayo teman-teman, akur lah. Lebih baik bersatu-padu untuk kemudian maju daripada bercerai-berai untuk kemudian menjadi abu, betul?

Wassalaam.

PS. Teman-teman di Malaysia, maaf ya bila saya menulis dalam bahasa Indonesia. Kalau ada yang mau tanya artinya dalam bahasa Inggris, boleh kok kirim e-mail ke saya. Nanti akan saya artikan.

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Dear Readers.

I refer to the recent commotion in Indonesia with regards to Rasa Sayang song used to promote tourism in Malaysia. Both countries fail to see eyes to eye with regards to the song.

Malaysia’s view is very simple and clear. It never claims to own the song. It does not know who creates such a catchy song. Malaysia until the commotion started did not know that some sections claimed that the song belongs to Indonesia. Malaysia uses the song as it is very popular folk song in the country. That is all.

As such, Malaysia feels there is no need to ask Indonesia’s permission with regard to using the song. Malaysians sinply fail to see what the fuss is all about.

Musics, cultural traditions, food are not restricted in one country. Beautiful musics will trancend boundary. I notice there are quite a number of Indonesian songs popular in Malaysia. And I was surprised that during my recent visit to Indonesia, I was approached by Indonesians asking about Siti Norhaliza and Anuar Zain.

My point is that it is next to impossible to claim certain traditional heritages as belonging to us only. Take for example. Kuda kepang. It is very popular in Johor, Malaysia. It maybe originated from Jawa but now is also considered as heritage by Johor Govt. Patrotism is one thing. But certainly paranoid is another issue.

What is exactly the issue. I believe it is deeper than that. Neighbours sometimes have problems. That is normal. But do discuss rationally. Indonesia is not happy among others about the alleged illtreatments of Indonesian workers in Malaysia, Pulau Sipadan and Ligitan, the perceived insult on the terminology “Indon”. alleged stealing Indonesian territory.

Malaysia on the other hand is not happy with certain element in Indonesia using it is a punching back to achieve their political gain. Many Indonesian press potrays Malaysia as cruel to Indonesian workers. bUt they forgot to report about thousands of maid running away after carting the lady of the houses jewellery, not to mention rapes cases.

Just as Indonesians hates the word “Indon”, Malaysians feel insulted with the word “Maling Sia”. I urged everybody stops the usage of words that insulted each other. Malaysians, now you know Indonesians hate the Word “indon”, please stop using the word. And Indonesians, I believe you also know is not nice to use the word “Maling Sia”.

Both are sovereign countries. Both are equal. nO “adik”. no “abang”. No such thing as simply because you are smaller in size that you have to kowtow. No such thing to behave as the big brother simply because one is bigger.

The respect is accorded, not forced on. And do stop the habit of showing which country contributes more, which country had better musics, which country is bigger, which country is more advanced. That is so petty. Both Malaysia and Indonesia has their plus points.

Both countries contribute. Malaysia does not deny the contributrion of Indonesian workers in construction industry. And Indonesia also accepts that more than 1 millions of its citizens earn a living in Malaysia. Youngs Malaysians are crazy about Indonesian movie “Heart” while many Indonesians respect Dr Mahathir and are in awe at Putrajaya.

Do realize that sometimes the argument that we have are actually no argument at all. Just that we see things differently.

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@Shamsul: the answers for ur Qs for 513 is over here, im glad if u can make it over here…
https://theunspunblog.com/2007/10/28/readers-request-may-13/

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@Vic.Kyle.Ellanne:
I don’t think our government ever claimed that Batik, Keris, Angklung (even Rasa Sayang) were from Malaysia. They simply says it were all from Malays, which includes all ethnic cultures in Nusantara. (BTW, what’s Angklung? DON’T LAUGH!!) However, by the way the constitution define “Malays”, no wonder everyone thinks Malaysia owns it.

For your reference if you want to know more about Angklung:
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angklung)

Quote from Jakarta Post:
“In Malaysia, the music is extensively promoted and the angklung itself is used in the country’s Truly Asia tourism campaign,” Budi said.
He said universities in Malaysia had conducted research on angklung synthesizers. The country is also trying to obtain a design patent for the angklung, much to the annoyance of Sundanese communities who have urged the Indonesian government to hit back and have been making every effort to demonstrate the angklung is a Sundanese instrument.
http://www.thejakartapost.com/yesterdaydetail.asp?fileid=20070921.T01

Quote from Antara:
“Pasca kasus sengketa Pulau Sipadan-Ligitan, klaim Malaysia atas batik, angklung, dan budaya Dayak, dan juga kiriman asap kebakaran hutan dari Indonesia ke Malaysia memang menjadi ujian yang berat bagi hubungan baik kedua negara.”
http://www.antara.co.id/arc/2007/10/28/rasa-sayange-antara-indonesia-dan-malaysia/

I believe sundanese ppl absolutely have no issue to share the the beauty of Angklung to others (not only to Malaysian), but further attempt to claim it as someones culture without even mention the origin of Angklung or the worst case trying to obtain a design patent for the angklung that will be a different story, that Hurts…

Peace 🙂

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@shanghai: Its TOO DAMN EMBARRASING! DAMN EMBARRASING!
@Vic.Kyle.Ellanne:
They simply says it were all from Malays, which includes all ethnic cultures in Nusantara. (BTW, what’s Angklung? DON’T LAUGH!!)

I agree with you… particularly when a COUNTRY like Malaysia trying to obtain copyright for Batik, then a patent for Angklung where even ur ppl doesn’t even know what Anglkung is 🙂
Its TOO DAMN EMBARRASING!

I think this is what triggered our Indonesian fellows to claim the Songs…

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a Vic.Kyle.Ellane so u are malaysian.Sorry Bro or Sis. I’d better go.. tired already…
Kind of EMBARASSED when “people” never argue the ownership of
1.’ I saw my mommy kissing Santa Claus”
2. ‘Jinggle Bell’
3. ’25 Disember is always Christmas Day for the world”
4. “Happy Birthday To You”
TQ mr unspun for allowing me to express my thought.
Sincerely yours
Dolah Kurdis (a Malaysian )

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Dear dolah Kurdis ,
actually, “Happy Birthday To You” is patented! It’s not a folksong although it’s the most popular English song. I read it in the paper last year & found the links here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Happy_Birthday_to_You
http://www.warnerchappell.com/wcm_2/song_search/song_detail/songview_2.jsp?esongId=126621000&view=fulllyrics
And if I’m not wrong, all the tittles you’d mentioned are not folksongs and were patented too.
It brought up the tittle “Auld Lang Syne” in my mind and found that this is a folksong which was never claimed to belongs to England or at least England didn’t ban anyone from using it too promote something. Bet you didn’t know it’s from the Scotts. Try see:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Auld_Lang_Syne
Well, luckily Rasa Sayang (e, hey, etc…) has not been translated to too many languages or else this embarrassment would go worldwide. HA HA HA.
* As much as I hate to quote a single source only, especially from wikipedia, it’s the most convenient! Cheers \(^_^)/

Dear Kamarul, u must be kidding, it’s over 200 comments, I’ll faint going through the whole thing!

For the benefits of all, try this link first: my first comment is in here too :p
https://theunspunblog.com/2007/05/10/should-unspun-or-shouldnt-unspun/
Then click on the link in the opening by Unspun – a comment by Michael Chick, ignore the rest.
Then the extended explanation in:
https://theunspunblog.com/2007/10/20/where-do-our-ancestors-come-from/ or (it’s the same)
https://theunspunblog.com/2007/10/02/rasa-not-so-sayang/#comment-26173

Now a bit of Law regarding the issue:
https://theunspunblog.com/2007/10/02/rasa-not-so-sayang/#comment-25449
And then this one for some discussion about folklores ownership: scroll down for answers
https://theunspunblog.com/2007/10/10/rasa-this/#comment-25950
I just have to include this, my summary half way:
https://theunspunblog.com/2007/10/02/rasa-not-so-sayang/#comment-26526

A fair quote here:
https://theunspunblog.com/2007/10/23/rasa-not-so-sayang-2-our-different-viewpoints/

And the summary,
https://theunspunblog.com/2007/10/26/out-of-step/

Now you can come back and comment. Cheers \(^_^)/
*I have to skip some Indonesian comments (coz difficult for me to understand) & might have missed some. But I think I covered most related one.

Dear doubledice,
For your point, please see above links…
Then hope you understand what I try to say:
Malaysia, with it’s population majority are “Malays” which somehow includes all Malay(as recognised by ancient Western powers to include brown coloured skin locals that speaks Bahasa Malaysia(Melayu) and Bahasa Indonesia) therefore shared many similar cultures with our neighbours in the “Nusantara”. What in the link you gave me were the Malaysian versions copyrighted to promote Malaysia which is no less to describe the Malaysian cultures. You sure don’t want your Indonesian Tourist Department to use Malaysian versions (not to say they will ever but just in case the mixed it up) to promote your country, don’t you.
Again I stress, they never say it originated from Malaysia!! But because Malaysia is Truly Asia, it blended everything from the region and that are well describing the people in this country. Why didn’t you highlight “Tian-Mi-Mi” in the site which is a Taiwanese score.
I hate to defend the ministry but that part I think it’s true, the part that is bothering everybody is that they conveniently forgotten to mention where all these things come from.

Dear Corlene, thanks for the link.

Dear Shamshul anuar,
I don’t think I want to start that unless Unspun likes too, it’s his blog leh!! It will be another heated debate if more Chinese readers see it. I’m sure Unspun & Michael will have lots of contribution in this Malays Special Rights issue. I’m too young to put my 2 cents on this, he he he. I’d already initiated one, have you put your view there?

Did everyone missed my comment on October 30th, 2007 at 4:43 am, how come no reply one?

BTW, Unpsun, with so much written and discussed regarding this issue, I think you could start compiling everyting and but it into publish: RASA SAYANG (E or Hey): When a culture divided by borders. Maybe can make big money :-p

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Dear dolah Kurdis ,
actually, “Happy Birthday To You” is patented! It’s not a folksong although it’s the most popular English song.

Yeap Vic the term “English” is no one to argue from Australia to N Zealand. or from the UK to USA. It is a clear cut. Eventhough is is not from England.Here we still debate on the definition of Nusantara and the Malays…

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Even national anthem they steal from our “terang bulan”?
Who can believe that rasa sayange is theirs
ha..ha..ha..
who is the real thief?
They think here Indonesian only pembantu rumah..
sorry bro..
almost 200 thousand Indonesian expatrite here have to cover “the malays (read: malas)

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@Tommy: and i didnt read any goddamn textbook to show to u that ur 7 points argument is just crap that can be thrown into laut jawa without any hesitation…no offense but i just wana tell u that its not how many info/facts u can get but what matters most is how ur brain processes tis info/facts into some usable arguments…FYI this basic process of human being is called THINKING…No hard feelings ya 🙂

again im asking u a simple question, who said that malaysia claimed the Rasa Sayange song belongs to Malaysia? fact1) we never claimed it; fact2) we use Rasa Sayang HEY not Rasa SayangE

so tommy u think, everything which is not malaysian, its indonesian? now this is really a bad thinking…u gave me a definition of NUSANTARA before and some examples right? i totally turned ur definition into trash simply becoz ur examples didnot fit…now if u can think, is NUSANTARA word is indonesian?

THINKING is the basic process of human being, please dont forget this 🙂

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as my self I never claim that meaningless Rasa Sayange is a Malaysian Song.
MTD Malaysian Tourist Departement also never claimed that is a Malaysian Song! they claimed Rasa Sayang Hey is the song from NUSANTARA. NUSA is Nesos. MTD only state that no one could STOP them from using that stooopid song.
The one and only claimed the song is theirs is Indonesian!!!!
Still to my point of view the is no bahasa Indonesia (sound so artificial). Like there is no American Language,Australian Language or New Zealand Language or Britian Language. But there is English Language and there is Bahasa Melayu. No such things as bahasa Brunei, Bahasa Singapura,Bahasa Malaysia, Bahasa Indonesia…as Kamarul syggested “THINK” do not rely on your thext book mr Tommy Joe.

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@dolah kurdis:
Malaysia DID claim the song as theirs.

http://www.heritage.gov.my/kekkwa/index.php?bahan=viewbudaya.php?id=62
–>8) Lagu-lagu Rakyat Malaysia (Zainal Abidin)

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@DeaGLe: i copy the text from the website u gave here ya

Hak Cipta Terpelihara : Kementerian Kebudayaan Kesenian & Warisan Malaysia (KEKKWA)
Tidak dibenarkan mengeluar “mana-mana bahagian dalam audio” ini dalam apa jua bentuk (elektronik/mekanikal) tanpa permohonan bertulis daripada KEKKWA

did u see the words in brackets? it mean “any part of the AUDIO”. now letme explain this misunderstanding brought by u. the audio files were created by the KEKKWA, so its reasonable to disallowed other ppl to copy the AUDIO file without permission lah. theres no such thing of claiming the song belongs to malaysia. “originality of the song” and “the permission of copying the audio file” have no synonymous meaning lah man

clear example here: those indonesian singers eg SO7(which i dislike due to its jiwangis nature hehe 🙂 ). now they publish their album here through local company. but then when the company say others cannot copy any part from the published album, then does this means the songs belong to the company? NO, the album belongs to the company but of course the songs belong to the indonesian band SO7 lah man. got the point? 🙂

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@Tommy: now let us see again ur comment above, its clear that ur own statement is contradicting with each other man. at first u explained that nusantara is a geographic definition. but then, u said malaysia is not nusantara and indonesia is nusantara (u went out of ur definition and putting political view as ur agenda). borneo whether it fulfills the definition of nusantara does not depends on whether any of its region belongs to certain nation, its a clear cut double standard here man.

if borneo is not nusantara, kalimantan also must not be nusantara. if kalimantan is part of indonesia, then indonesia can never be nusantara becoz of kalimantan. if the definition of nusantara is geographic position then u must accept this. if u donot accept this, it means ur definition of nusantara is not geographical-based but only to fulfill ur political agenda right? enlighten urself first before u enlighten others, cheers man 🙂

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unspun, yes i agree you. with the look of it it wont happened at our time but we must go towards it right now. this bickering of nusanatara, rasa sayang and other petty thing has to be stopped . we know now you dont like to be called Indo… ( i refused to put n there) then we malaysian should stop calling them by that name. you said rasa sayang song is yours .. so we should not use that song to promote malaysia. we have many composers who can compose new better song to suit the promotional activities. i sometime feel our goverment officials is too much defending unecessary things but on indonesian side you sometimes are too sensitive and make the small issues becoming very big issue. we people on both side, politicians alike should sit down and trash up things through more dialogue, communications, musyawarah and politicians should prevent saying unpleasant things that make the other side unhappy. in fact you shuld also encourage your people or the bloggers to stop calling us Malingsia or other bad names. we are sensitive human being too.

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gak malu tuuuh nyuri…nyuri….mau untung yaaaaaaa? dasar malingsia …sadar…wey… tapi mendingan kita berdamai deh and kembalikan deh semua that have been stolen..dimaaafin kok….tapi klo gak sadar…kita akan bertindak…awas…awas warga indonesia itu banyak lho kalah lah pasti…. dasar maling sia pencuri… tak berpendidikan

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Diadjeng Ina Diadjeng Yanti
there you go mr @ralph!!
kita orang Malaysia memang maling. Sering mencuri, tak pernah sekolah, malah buanyak sekali melakukan kriminal di seluruh Nusantara milik Indonesia semuanya.
Buanyak sekali warga malingsia yang datang berobat di Indonesia yang semuanya puas pelayanan spesialis rumah sakit korban lelaki.
Menteri kami semuanya Menteri Semak Belukar, tentara kami itu namanya lasykar basah kuyup, kalau “push up” kami bilang setubuh dengan bumi. Kalau berjalan di tempat kami bilang “hentak-hentak bumi”…

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@Kamarul.
About Bahasa Indonesia…
Yes… Bahasa Indonesia (which now we can just call Bahasa, the world will know it means Bahasa Indonesia, not Bahasa Malayu) sounds much alike Malay. But as the time goes on, both language have grown seperatedly.

Bahasa (Indonesia) has been enriched by other languages, International languages( English, Dutch, Potuguese, Arabic, Indian, Chinese, etc) and traditional languages (Java, Batak, Sunda, Bali, Ambon, Palembang, etc).

So Bahasa Indonesia is not purely Malay anymore, that’s why we don’t call it Malay. We call it Bahasa Indonesia as Indonesia’s official national language, that is used in formal speaking throughout the country.
Meanwhile the traditional language still widely used in daily informal speaking.

Now the international community have accept that the two languages are different, just as the different between Arabic and Kurd or between Mandarin and Cantonese.

And it is internationally accepted that Indonesian language is adressed as “Bahasa Indonesia” or just “Bahasa”, and Malay/Malaysian language as “Malay”.

The separated developments of the two languages (Malay and Bahasa) have given different quality to both languages. My australian friend learnt Bahasa in his school and his college. And when he heard Malay, he said he like Bahasa better, because both languages have different taste in his ears.

Aculturation is common to all languages in the world. If you, MR Kamarul, says that Bahasa is the same as Malay, you should visit Indonesia. You will hear that people here speak absolutely diferent from you.

I, two years ago visited your KL. I hardly understand the Malay language so I prefer English to speak to the Malays. How can you say Bahasa is the same as Malay?

In the Malay’s benefit, I think Indonesian people conserve Malay language better than the Malaysian. Because in Indonesia, English is not so favoured as it is in Malaysia.

We never accuse Malaysian steal our language(s). We know we have better language. It is Bahasa Indonesia or you can just say BAHASA, and that also means Bahasa Indonesia. (“,)

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Kamarul,
But, I thought MC said that Malay are actually originally come from Jambi? If we use the same analogy as Rasa sayange that you use on your analogy above, that means the Malaysian will also have to reciprocate that bahasa melayu are originally come from jambi???

Oopsie… sorry unspun, I’ve guess i’ve stepped the line of crooked thinking territory :))

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Thats right, so you must surely acknowledge that malay tribe are, originally comes from Sumatra. Thats what im asking here dude….

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But, I read somewhere (i think wikipedia) that The Malaysian government kept changing their national language from bahasa melayu, bahasa malaysia, bahasa kebangsaan. Whats the different?

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Bosnian, Croatian and Serbian used to be called Serbo-croatian, Creole used to be French, Afrikaans used to be Dutch, Indonesian used to be Malay. Some languages evolve and diverge, naturally or politically. In Indonesia’s case, I think both (I’m no linguist though).

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@dolah: yeap kubang kerian, finished my LSP402 in first year and LHP456 in second year aledy. im in 4th year now hehe…why suddenly ask? 🙂

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utk lebih detail apa aja yg diambil ama si maling
lihat alamat berikut…

http://www.heritage.gov.my/kekkwa/index.php?bahan=viewbudaya.php?id=27

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then there is no such things like “permissions” “ethical”, “stealing” right? since no Malays ptotests to Indonesian regarding the changes from bahasa Melayu to bahasa Indonesia. So I think I am going to miss the discussions…as for me its already came to the conclusion…
Why I ask? @kamarul he he he I have a telepathy kinda mind….completed LHP456 good …I think I can even give the name of your English Language Instructors…

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@dolah: huh telepathy, dats kinda worries me hehe. are u one of those language center ppl? give me some hint on who u are…maybe u can private email me here naimy2k2000@yahoo.com

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uiks im sure the title of this thread is Rasa Not So Sayang, i wondered if unspun could simply change the topic…perhaps the easiest way to change the topic is by going to another thread with another topic, am i right?

these are words from bahasa melayu—> masih, rasa, sayang, basi, ganti, topik, muntah, darah, baca, kosong, -nya, balik, sana. No hard feelings, cheers man 🙂

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@Bonar: we malaysians donot have any problem with indonesians speaking bahasa melayu, uguys can use it, can promote it, can commercialize it anyway uguys like, just feel free, plus uguys definitely have no need to ask anybody’s permision. i believe cultures, language, musics belong to the ppl, it can never be restricted to certain geographical boundaries man…

of course its okay when theres enough ppl to feel comfortable with the term, im not gonna push the malaysian govern to bring this bahasa melayu case to the ICJ either hehe :-). yeah a language got alot of sub-bahasa or we called it dialects, even here in malaysia. but um its just, like all the dialects u mentioned above it got this melayu riau etc, the word melayu is there right and the word riau explained the dialect. but rebadging bahasa melayu into bahasa indonesia is another different case. im glad that its to honor, exalt, the culture of melayu, why dont we called it bahasa melayu indonesia? its still bahasa melayu but the dialect is being used by indonesians. just like melayu singapura, melayu brunei etc….

eg: american english, canadian english, australian english etc and not american language, canadian language, australian language, right? To conclude, its bahasa melayu malaysia, melayu singapura, melayu brunei, melayu indonesia, melayu sambas, melayu mempawah, melayu pontianak, or farther, melayu riau, melayu deli, melayu palembang, etc… certainly not bahasa indonesia, bahasa malaysia, bahasa singapura, bahasa brunei….
Peace 🙂

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we donot know which one came first, rasa sayang hey or rasa sayange, so in this case we donot know which one being copied or which one is the copy…

Kamarul, I want you to prove me, show me a hard evidence that the people in Malaysia has been singing rasa sayange longer than Indonesia.

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Hey guys, it’s okay for Malaysian to steal Rasa sayange.
but please, make sure you guys steal Jablay, kopi dangdut, Bisik-bisik tetangga, poco poco, Bukan pengemis cinta, Sekuntum mawar merah next time. those song are FAR better then the Rasa Sayange itself, Believe me!

It’s basically for tourist attraction, right? we love your CALL MANIA CENTER. yes it is, it’s a lovely thing to spend time on the Internet other than watching replays of Mat Rempit show or watching pak lah sleeping. next time, we’ll cheer for your guys Soyuz to successfully reach the moon, and bring back the moonstone for us. we’ll make better Rendang out of it next time you guys visit our countries, oh and.. don’t forget to speak Melayu next time you guys visit Indonesia, it’s kinda numb when we think about it that you guys speak English in out countries.

cheers!

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@kamarul: “claiming to belong to one nation should have never been brought up” I disagree, by having this discussion, one may get insights about many things.

We, indonesians, accused malaysia, becoz we thought, it was undeniably original mollucan’s, it was just an overly common knowledge here about the origin of that song.

We thought our mollucan brothers were being ripped off, we reacted, probly overreacted, mostly even,
becoz at first media coverage didnt talk about the possibility that it COULD be from malaysia,
they never talked about that it is also common for malaysians to think that it is original malaysians folksong.

But judging from the reaction of your officials, of which i think quite genuine, at least, you -didnt intend- to do harm.

The beauty of the whole dialectics, is that now we know your points, vice versa, we dont necessarily agree, but we understand that, maybe, we are not that different at all.

Like unspun said before, we witness changes of attitude by this.

It might require a cultural research about this particular song just for academic sake, or just to satisfy our curiousity, perhaps? or it may be a ladder for cultural cooperations, who knows…

@Bluey: We might think that we have a better position by having the 1962 record, and, i heard, even from the 1930s, but solving this by those proofs will only scratch the surface of the culture clash. Co-operation to better understand each other is a much better option.

@Radeonator: ahhh, come on brother, enough with the taunting. Lets move on.

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To V** or something who said that Malaysian is embarrasing for claiming the copyrights of batik and angklung.

My questions to you

1. Show me the copyrights.
2. Tell me how KFC is not wronged for claiming the “Fried Chicken”

I hope your mouth is as good as your brain.

Peace.

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Batik (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batik) as I ever knew before is about the techniek in the field of textile. I ever learned “membatik” at school when I had to make motives on white textile (kain putih) used the techniek of “membatik”. The result is that both sides of the textile will have similar quality (no back and front side). The techniek (so far I know) is that by coloring it in colored liquid. To make drawings you can use wax and canting, but also I ever learned a simple way to create a motive (drawing) just by using plastic and rope as cover. Only, I’m confused about “batik cetak” which I think it is considered to be batik in terms of the motives (types of drawing).

Bahasa Indonesia is not just about Melayu. It may contain a lot of words considered to be originated from Bahasa Melayu (probably because of the most popular language in the region at that time), but it consists of some other local and foreign languages as well included those from colonial era. The concept of Bahasa Indonesia is that (as I ever learned) it won’t stop growing and will adapt new words (if necessary) from other languages (in this world). Therefore, this new language (Bahasa Indonesia) as one of Indonesian cultural products will be enriched.

About “Nusantara”, I do agree very much with the argument on geographical term. It means basically: (Nusa + Antara) island(s) between two continents and two oceans. This term and understading helped Indonesia to win the “Zona Exclusive Economy” argument when Indonesia has to face her special condition of teritory which contains not only lands but also seas. I can imagine if some people say different things about Nusantara based on the condition of what Indonesia really is in broader sense than geographical term. 😉

In the case of the song “Rasa Sayange” which is one of the famous cultural heritages in Indonesia, I can imagine if Indonesians feel irritated by the action of Malaysia use Indonesian product to promote Malaysian touristic industry. And, I can’t feel more irritated by Malaysian government who (without any shame) promotes her own country as the representative of what Asia really is. Come on!!! As other Indonesians would say, I say: Be Smarter!!!

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Re: Rasa Sayange brought over by Ambonese community to Malaysia- I just have to comment: Ambonese community in Malaysia? You do realize that they are mostly Christian, thus making them Christian yet Malay thus they are all criminal of apostasy under Malaysian law. My casual guess is that there is NO Ambonese community in Malaysia. Prove me wrong.

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@kemsey

Gee, I guess the Malaysia Government can announce that the Ambonese in Malaysia has CONVERT to malay so it’s gonna be hard to find them in Malaysia.

This race classification based on religion is ridiculous.

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MAlINGSIA IS THE RACIST COUNTRY
China saja didiskriminasi di malaysia , india apa lagi, orang melayu mala7uy ini adalah xenophobia, idiot dan pemalas. salam dari china indonesia

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Just for fun and more about Malay Language (Bahasa Malaysia or Bahasa Indonesia), try see here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malay-based_creole_languages

Dear Kamarul,
Admire you spirit here! Why would you want to repeat the same thing over and over again? Haven’t you noticed that these thread has been repeating? Everything in the last 10 ~ 20 comments could have been explained earlier. Nothing new has been added. It seems our friends in Indonesia refuses to have an understand and just want to pick a fight. They just want to show that they are better and they started everything. Let them be, they can’t change nothing.
I must compliment you for stopping to use the word Indon but you see, most of them just don’t deserve the respect. Just a few so far I see their wise comments, the rest are simply rubbish.

This thread has become less and less intellectual. I’d just came in to have fun now. Not going to do anymore explanation nor defends. It just won’t going to change a thing.

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Wow, John Wai is a fine example of Chinese being the most adaptable people. You see, Chinese can easily blend into any cultures and country. As the old Chinese wisdom: “Follow The Tradition Of The Village You Going Into.”

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Rasa Sayang is such a nice song I sang almost everyday when I learn it even before I go to school. I even learned my “pantun” with Rasa Sayang and duet with the girl next door, he he. It was such a romantic song but from this thread, it became so pathetic. Sayang = Love but now it sounds more like = Sorry.

Feeling Sorry hey!
Feeling Sorry Sorry hey!
Hey! Look at people in here feeling Sorry Sorry Hey!

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@Vic: planning to do so, i aledy had my own conclusions on this rasa sayang hey issue and my overall perception on indonesian ppl, thanks for reminding me…i guess thats all folks. enlightenment is enjoyable, try it urself. cheeers 🙂

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Ha ha, Kamarul, I really can’t read your Kelantanese :p

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@Vic: haha the first part is kelantanese which i copied from bus stands in KB, the latter part is perakian, no wonder u cannot understand hehe 🙂

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Oh, didn’t know Perak has it’s own dialect. You said you were from Kuala Kangsar? I heard it’s a nice city.

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@Vic: yeap perak got own dialects, not only one. Group 1: kuala kangsar, sayong etc, Group 2: manong, menore, Group 3: Bota, Parit etc Group 4: taiping, bagan serai….

Group 1,2,3 are purely perakian dialects, however if u hear ppl from these areas speak, it seemed that they sound so different, but basically the words are the same, only pronunciation differs. Group 4 uses nothern dialect like penang, kedah etc…

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Err…Shamshul

The Dutch has been colonizing for Indonesia more than 10 generations. During that time, countless battle are waged by local Indonesian Leader like Pattimura, Cut Nyak Dien, Fatahillah, and many more that I can not possibly named each one. Thats why we, Indonesian are very proud of how we got our Independence, our history book are colored by many brave heroes who died for something called independence.

But frankly if the British is the one who colonized Indonesia, maybe we don’t have to fight for our Indonesia. British have always give Independence to their colonized territories if they can afford it.

Can anyone explain why India is so hard to give up by the British? It puzzled me

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huh why choose a very hard topic one, i dont know what to say woo… 🙂

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Dear triedtobehonest, Tea, maybe? You know how the English are crazy about tea. India produces Diamonds too!! Also, the ethnic clashes in India is far worse than Malaysia then (now even?) Maybe the English thinks India not ready yet?

Haha, Kamarul. you been link to co-own this thread already.

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Dear triedtobehonest,
Australian were convicts ma 🙂

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Dear triedtobehonest,
in case u ask, New Zealand were lunatics :p

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Dear Bonar,
they had the Supremacy issue ma. Like the Nazy case lar.
Anyway, Malaysia almost didn’t made it although the British knew they had to leave soon. The WWII drained their resources but they can’t afford to lose the trade route in Straits of Malacca.

Why am I being serious again. Ha ha.

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@Vic.Kyle.Ellanne

Bull’s eye comments

@Bonar

True to triaas politica, it tried to give back to Indonesian something. But in reality its the dutch who gained from it. Cheap labor for plantation outside Java, Irigation for the plantation, and someone who’s not illiterate to do the lowly official work.

hehehe, if you edit the print preview to dismiss all of Kamarul comment, I am sure you can save 50% of the paper. Sorry kamarul, no hard feeling. I just can’t stop myself 😀

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@bonar
you’re right, if they didn’t open up schools for pribumi, where would Sukarno, Hatta, and many others go???
BTW, I like your first comment. Me, too are raised in an area with predominant malay tribe (Pontianak & Batam).

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Kamarul, u r famous in this thread. I think your contributions really takes up half the thread!! HA HA (^o^)

I thought Pontianak is an evil ghost? So it’s a place also. He he, my Geography must be questioned.

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Yellow Walk, yesterday. the compliment should go to BERSIH, a coalition on free and fair elections made up by 34 political parties and NGOs. i think an UMNO member of parliment oso took part, Ruhanie Ahmad?

Memorandum was sent to the King although he was not at the palace that time, riding horses in homestate Terengganu. and estimated crowd was more than 100 000 ppl, although the mainstream media claimed otherwise

wana see stream video on the whole event here http://www.tvpas.com/mainpage.php?cat=index

wana read more/photos here
http://www.harakahdaily.net and http://rockybru.blogspot.com/

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@triedtobehonest: hnggg? awak orang ponti jua ke? ish ish ish balak jua ye internet ni, dahla kesanak kemari, ujong2e ketemu kite2 jak! (reading clue: u hav to imagine me talking with r bekarat) :p
i was living there for 3 years, during my hs years, you? and where do u live now? im in jogja, and probly papua next year.
Hmm, My first post… after re-thinking about it, was actually into the category of “crooked thinking” as explained on unspun’s other post. Probably becoz my lack of arguing skill, since i didnt intend any harm.

@kamarul: youre the biggest target, youre the most resourceful (aside from mc and vic, i guess), and youre admirably the most passionate, yet ironically, u declare this whole thing as “not that important to be discussed”. and no, im not trying to pick a fight, thats a compliment. 🙂

@Vic: chinese populations in that city called pontianak as khuntien,
and to me, khuntien’s chinese cuisine is the BEST! even until years, im still craving, and wondering why did i leave that city. u should go there sometimes.

@unspun: i just read your response on my comment, lol, i rarely go to lapo lah, u’re generalizing bataknese people! 🙂 but ok, 1 or 2 glasses of tuak with a slightly heated conversations, wont do harm, i suppose. 🙂

…and this thread is now becoming a place of social interaction

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Chinese food always good!! Ha ha (self promoting!! cheh)

Chinese in Pontianak called Khuntien? That’s cute, I wonder what Chinese word does it translate into? Since Bonar my friend strongly recommend, I will brave myself someday to face the Pontianak and taste the cuisine there. It better be so good to die for!! He he he he he…

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@unspun: my comment is awaiting moderation. im sure its not offensive, is it akismet again?

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Oh u BET it is good to die for! I am FANATICAL about this! :p

this is from “jalansutra” column of bondan winarno’s, hes one of the most respected food taster (is that even a job description?) in indo:

http://www.kompas.co.id/utama/news/0404/15/134412.htm

Jalansutra means “book/sutra of travelling”. Hmmm, but then u might not be able to understand his words…. y am i making a fool of miself…

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@Vic: hehe and why is that u r the one being caught by akismet the most?

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Dear Bonar,
thanks for the link. His Bahasa not too hard for me, I still can “cari makan”. I’d saved the link, got chance must go. I almost forgotten the food must be halal. Surprised at first when the Malays (I think) trying out Chinese food. In Malaysia nowadays, Malays don’t go into Chinese restaurant anymore. Unlike the old days when everyone – Chinese, Malay or Indian, all would “minum kopi” together in a coffee shop (for those didn’t know, traditional coffee shop or “kopitiam” are restaurant basically run by immigrant from Hainan province in China, they serve good coffee and toast breads/buns)

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U can get halal food and the non-halal in pontianak, i suppose.
Dont forget, there are moslem chinese too (i mean theyre two completely different concept, arent they?).

in fact, here in my place in jogjakarta (somewhere in java island), the owner of the most-famous-traditional-cookie-in-the-city’s recipe is a moslem chinese.
The former president, Abdurahman (gus dur), claimed that he is a chinese descendant, and he is an avid moslem thinker.

Up until i was 5, my parents told me,
my main language was tiochiu(local chinese dialects, i suppose), coz my breastfeeding mother was a chinese also,
until my parents realized that i couldnt communicate in bahasa indonesia at all, that my kindergarten teacher thought i was an idiot(shes probly right anyway,lol),
then they brainwashed me with english, bahasa indonesia, and bataknese, made me totally forgot about tiochiu.

ok. im blabbering.

my point is, i might be a christian bataknese (a proto-malay ethnic), and i strongly promote malay culture in my javanese environment, or promote bataknese culture in a predominantly malay places.
But when it comes to FOOD, i have YET to find something that can beat khuntien’s chinese cuisines, halal or not.

when it comes to food, im my breastfeeding mother’s son.

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Dear Unspun,
I never started of like that lar, but ended that way instead, ha ha, just kidding.
Never in my opinion that all Indonesian are bad, just some, usually these are the vocal ones. So does Malaysian, some are bad some are good. But the majority of the bad in Malaysia are running the country. Ha ha ha.

As for Kamarul, I got no comment. Ha ha ha ha (kidding pal)

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I just salute Indonesian like @Bonar,@treidtobehonest, they gave me the other sides of point, where I do sometimes agree and sometimes agree to disagree..well that is common (lumrah)this is what Gandi’s said “I have no enemies, only a friends with a different opinions” the same goes to @bonar, @triedtobehonest.
but this Tommy Joe is really “kampungan” you want to celebrate your hari Pahlawan go ahead! If you knew nothing about you neighboring countries background why dont you go and eat your ice cream somewhere! dont’t have to bring it up here such a secondary school kid kind of mentality!!! you really spoild the Indonesian scholars lol….

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@bonar
great Mathematic that you have given us (especially me) here. Yes I do believe in different opinion. It is too stupid for the Tourist department not to admit that its from Maluku and it is too “over reacted” to force the Malaysian goverment ( I am Malaysian sometimes disagree eith the goverment) to ask permission or to accused of stealing the song ; ). Or it is a huge problems here. If this is a robbery case , what or how much is the lost? and that Rasa Sayang song still can be used in Indonesia,Singapore or Brunei.

The term of stealing here is like the Malaysian (plus the goverment)broke into the Indonesian goldsmith and the owner really suffering bankcruptcy right now at the moment.

Malaysian and the goverment of Malaysia is two different subjects. I hope the same goes to the Indonesian and the goverment of Indonesia. I would think it is a “faith” for us to quarrel among each other since the era of confrontations. To me it is so special that its only happens between malaysia and Indonesia! ; ) never happen Indonesia vs Thai, or Malaysia vs Myanmmar. And to my prediction this will go on and on to our next generations if we passed the wrong idealogies between this two special of traditional enemies (mush tradisi or “musuh berbuyutan” as the Betawi’s Malay said)

Well as mr unspun said I honestly could not find other interesting topic as hot as this. : )

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@kamarul: “proving that Rasa Sayang Hey is a copy of Rasa Sayange is far more important than proving that Rasa Sayange belongs to Indonesia”

ok now, that i agree. but like stated on unspun’s other article, a bigger problem doesnt diminish the original problem.

“not making any point is just plain not making any point man”

my original point is simple actually, why not use malay song instead?
but then who am i to ask that

then i change my mind, ok maybe u didnt mean to harm, lets put a disclaimer or something maybe stating that the song was originated from maluku, at least to satisfy our ambonese brothers.

my next point is, there are probably underlying problems, lets think this through, who knows it will prevent future incidents.

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@dolah kurdis
LOL, yeah, i guess so…
this has become chat room after all, and overstretched, my bad, sorry.

those new points of yours(prove me wrong) are also a bit overstretched, but either you do that deliberately, or there is something u wanna tell me later, i will TRY to give my opinion on each of them. cmiiw

1. The history of srivijaya have covered many many regions, it has influenced many many modern countries in terms of spirit and cultures.
but to be honest, i really think it is thailand or myanmar which has more rights to claim as the historical continuation of srivijaya, but for that i need further research(fyi, im not really into history, i was an engineering student drop out).
When the founding fathers of indonesia incorporated srivijaya and majapahit into our history and national thinking, they never meant they were only ours, as some people might misintrepret them,

what they were trying to say was this, a unified nation was POSSIBLE even though the archipelago was separated by geographical and geocultural differences.
It happened before, it can happen again.
(i forgot where i read this polemics, but i remember reading those difficult old words,lol)

and that statement by NO means was trying to negate srivijaya’s influence to your version of history, or trying to rob srivijaya from you.

2. LOL, thats new to me… soekarno’s syndrome… i bet mr. incredible and elastigirl will appreciate this new information. 🙂

Well… spot on, i never remembered our syllabus talked about malaysia, beside few paragraphs about konfrontasi (again hs was so long ago,cmiiw).

normally, i would say:”move on to the next person, i dont wanna hear you, we already have our own problems”
but since youre seeing me wearing soekarno’s symbols on my head, now i would say: enlighten me!

what is exactly soekarno’s syndrome? what are the things that u consider as soekarno’s syndrome? how are they relevant to present day discourse?
did you personally experienced this syndrome IRL (in real life)?

If indonesians talked down about you on that matter, we probably just didnt know or didnt care about your history, we -were- just a bunch of ignorants.
for that i sincerely am sorry.
But i encourage you not to let us tear you down. it doesnt matter what we’re saying, you know yourself better than we do.

Stigmatizing indonesians to a single definition is bad for your emotional well-being 🙂 relax… we cant really be all that bad, can we? 🙂

however, i cant help miself, i need to ask this: is it becoz of that, you become ignorant about our complaints and whinings 🙂 on things like that infamous song?

3. honestly, i never heard that. I encourage YOU, to write a book/report/blog about it, before the witnesses are all gone, or force YOUR government to protest or take actions. Just tone it down a little, so we can understand your points and not just your anger.
it never occured to my mind the thought that an event was the underlying problem, i thought they were differences in conceptual matters.

4. It amazed me that you know tuanku tambusai 🙂 what about tuanku rao? do u know him also? sisingamangaraja?
ok nvm about rao and singa.
I agree, they never fought for the republic, they fought sporadically for their own reasons and for their own regional independence, albeit against the same enemy,
to us, indonesians, those are real facts too, we call it “fase terpecah belah” or “perjuangan bersifat kedaerahan” (i dunno how to translate it).

want more? tuanku imam bonjol of minang fought against traditionalist, pangeran diponegoro of yogyakarta fought becoz of land dispute, kongsi cina of singkawang against high taxing, and many others fought for their own reasons.

However, those same facts, even strengthen our national identity… our nationbuilding, when we realize, we had to unite.
The reason those stories were told was to show our people that unified efforts are better options. The Republic was founded by recognizing their weakneses.

for us, its a non problem.

And for the last remark, i actually quite agree 🙂

so, whats all these having to do with our polemic?

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UNSPUN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I want my comment posted!! Please… Please… Please… Please… Please… Please… Please… Please… Please… Please… Please… Please… Please… Please… Please… Please… Please… Please…

Restored, I hope. It helps is you keep comments short and do not include links. or if links spell it out. Akismet arrests anything with more than 2 links. This spam thingo is frustrating. Over the past few days there has been 1,600 plus spam. Gubrak!

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I wonder anyone would write a book about the history of ASEAN countries. Most that I know of now are generally modern histories. Hey, we also have civilisation up to 2 millenia ago but very hard to find information. Couldn’t be Srivijaya, Majapahit and the other ancient civilization here just vanished like the Mayas, or maybe sanked like the Atlantis? or we are Atlantis!!?

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oooppsss…. my fault? sorry… ;p are we telepathically connected?

gosh i was wrong, im not klingon, im vulcan! we’re both vulcan!

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I got it!! more than 2 links not good, yes! But some got no links and sweet and short also leh :p

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I donno man, I donno! Maybe I surfed porn too much they traced my IP!! 😀 Now they also found out I’m challenging them :p Must start learning anti-hacking before they trace my house. Ha ha ha ha. Now I nead Michael’s power to manipulate electrical devices. Does Akismet go under-table?

So the minister finally talk wise? Funny that this come out after another monkey talk in the worldmedia (Al’Azeera)!

So does this mean end of this issue? Is this thread finally closing. I’m just starting to have fun here!!

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Unspun, I can find the article …. you have to access directly to their link below..
—
Malaysia Akhirnya Akui Rasa Sayange Milik Indonesia
Selasa, 13 November 2007, 08:38:29

Jakarta, myRMnews. Pemerintah Malaysia akhirnya menyerah soal polemik lagu Rasa Sayange. Menteri Kebudayaan, Kesenian, dan Warisan Malaysia Rais Yatim telah bertemu dengan Menteri Kebudayaan dan Pariwisata Jero Wacik. Dalam pertemuan itu, Malaysia mengakui lagu Rasa Sayange sebagai lagu asli Indonesia.

Ketua Umum DPP Persatuan Artis Penyanyi, Pencipta Lagu, dan Penata Musik Rekaman Indonesia (PAPPRI) Dharma Oratmangun mengatakan, dalam kunjungan ke Malaysia, lahir kesepahaman antara Jero Wacik dan Rais Yatim. “Persoalan lagu Rasa Sayange selesai. Secara de facto, Malaysia mengakui itu milik Indonesia,” kata Dharma kemarin (12/11).

Pernyataan eksplisit Rais Yatim, menurut Dharma, disampaikan saat acara Temu Jembatan Budaya di Kuala Lumpur kemarin. Dharma merupakan salah seorang anggota delegasi kebudayaan Indonesia. “Oleh Pak Menteri (Menbudpar Jero Wacik) disampaikan bahwa sebagai negara bertetangga, semua persoalan agar diselesaikan dalam konteks masing-masing. Adapun lagu Rasa Sayange sudah bisa dipahami sebagai warisan yang dipunyai Indonesia,” jelas Dharma.

Lagu tersebut memang hidup di masyarakat secara luas hingga ke Malaysia. Karena itu, rakyat Malaysia juga mengenal dengan baik lagu tersebut. “Jadi, tidak ada masalah lagi,” tegasnya.

Jero Wacik saat dihubungi tadi malam membenarkan bahwa masalah lagu Rasa Sayange sudah tuntas. “Sebenarnya, tidak hanya masalah itu yang dibahas. Ada banyak hal,” kata Jero. Sayang, pembicaraan tidak berlanjut karena Jero sedang mengikuti jamuan makan malam.

Sebelumnya, kementerian kebudayaan Malaysia mengakui telah lalai menggunakan lagu Indonesia lainnya. Yakni, lagu Tiar Ramon karya musikus Minang, yang digunakan tarian delegasi Malaysia pada Asia Festival 2007 di Osaka.

Indonesia tidak akan memperkarakan lagu dan kesenian yang dipakai Malaysia. Sebab, Indonesia dan Malaysia masih serumpun. Hanya, Indonesia meminta, jika Malaysia menggunakan kesenian Indonesia, harus diumumkan kepada publik bahwa itu berasal dari Indonesia.

Di Malaysia, selain menghadiri Temu Jembatan Budaya, Jero Wacik membuka Indonesia Trend (Trade, Tourism, and Investment) Expo 2007 di Kuala Lumpur. Itu merupakan pameran produk-produk ekspor Indonesia ke Malaysia. jpnn

Source: http://www.myrmnews.com/indexframe.php?url=situsberita/index.php?pilih=lihat_edisi_website&id=46461

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why are you bother whether we want to call Malaysia boleh. whether our astronouts wants to show teh tarik in space. that is only side show to entertain our children about science and what can be done when you are in space. behind that our Dr Shukor conducted research on behalf of Japan goverment on crystalisation on protein , another research on behalf of European Union and our own research on cancer cell . do you have no other thing to do despite complaining about what we have done and intend to do. this is the mentality of jealous people. it is our money and we never ask you a single cents to fund this project. we can do what we want with our money. period

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I have every right to complaint about the ethics of my country!! It’s FUN!! And no one can stop me!! WAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!

Everyone knows our Angkasawan went up there FOC. It’s not even by our own effort, so what so proud about it? Just like how Malaysia bought the sit for Alex in F1. What a disgrace!!

Hmmm…. maybe I am jealous. Jealous about other country that has better technology than us. Jealous that other country has better financial status. Jealous that our currency is so weak. Jealous that I didn’t get the PTPTN loan (don’t even bother to check if I spelled right).

But should I? I’m driving a Kancil that no other country has, so uniquely Malaysian (borrowed the slogan from Singapore, haha). We have proton that can’t compete in international level, so special. MAS serving cold food, u don’t get this everywhere!

Who in the world don’t complaint about some of his/her own country policies? Bhutan, maybe. I wonder how it’s like living up there.

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Just don’t burn Malaysia flag will do. OK? Fellow friends in Nusantara?

Think about that idiot that burnt his own country flag in Terengganu. I have a gun, I’ll shoot him. TRAITOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Oh… condolence to the angkasawan family for losing his brother.

Just to clarify, I’m not against the Angkasawan project. Just the idea of doing teh-tarik on space? That’s something you don’t need to boost, expecially when it’s not your own transport. You want to do that in Measat-3 I don’t care.

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Ahh..ini bukan hanya sekedar berdebat soal ini lagu aslinya milik siapa..atau makanan ini berasal dari mana.. atau kesenian ini adalah milik siapa..

Saya tau, di sekolah dasar di Malaysia tidak ada pelajaran sejarah, makanya rakyatnya seperti buta dan arogan tanpa arah.

Tapi seharusnya bangsa Malaysia menghargai dan menghormati hak kekayaan kesenian, kebudayaan dan kekayaan intelektual dari bangsa lain.

Dan diam bukan berarti mengalah.. tapi demi menjaga sopan santun dari kami yang tidak kalian punya.

Untuk Malaysia, mulai sekarang coba peliharalah rasa malu.

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Kamarul ok let’s now sing
rasa hey hey hey
rasa hey hey hey hey hey hey
heyyy hey hey hey hey jauh hey hey hey hey hey
well like @bonar says if we had 1 cap like Betsy here in Malaysia I must times 10 Betsy in Indonesia. well I agree. The ministry admitted it is belongs to Indonesia..I have no problem at all. Well known let wait n see what else that they going to claimed! lol

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now I agree with @ralph. now Vic.Kyle I am not a Dr M worshipper neither hate him.
1. What is wrong with Malaysia Boleh? Most Indonesian make fun of it including you…he he heneed not to mentioned Truly Asia.
2. If the astronaut wanted to play 7 stones or kites (much easier) no gravity at all what it has to do with Indonesian?
3. Malaysia Truly Asia slogan? Indonesia used to have “Lets go archipelagos” not even one Malaysian write a protest.
4. Why bother about a trip and research by the astronaut sice there is not a single Rupiah been asked from Indonesian. Well it is not FOC part of it, as a tax payer its from my income tax that they taken to pay the Russian.
5. Do you think I got that PTPTN?please la.. dont be so selfish.Thank god I have 3 elders (sisters and brother) who willing to sponsored me for my 1st degree. Now I deep insdie somewhere I felt I have to do some sort of pay back to my nephew or niece….

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Hooi Dolah,

Aren’t you the one who poke around Indonesia philosophies, histories and stuff?

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Pratiwi Sudharmono, Ph.D is a scientist and with NASA/Challenger, she had an actual mission, thus more than just a ‘space participant’.

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wow…i wondered how this ‘space’ issue being shot down to earth in this thread. somebody must use the latest Chinese missile that hit the satellite haha

@Bonar: really appreciate that attitude…good man Cheers 🙂

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@dollah

Just curious… Is your father an indonesian troop who landed in Johor? It seems you know a lot about indonesia… may be it’s part of your effort to trace your ancestry 🙂

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Yes, I remember the day the Challenger accident, and I thought to myself ‘there goes our Pratiwi’s chance’. Btw, I’m not criticizing Malaysia’s space efforts, I am just reiterating from Malaysian blogs like jeffooi.com for this and other news updates from jiran.

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Finnally…. It got concluded.
Rais Yatim who was so proudly saying “Rasa Sayange’ song is Malaysia’s.
Now stupidly admitted that the song belongs to Indonesia.
Like the old saying… “Like a dog who eats his own puke”

I’d like to appologize to Unspun and everyone who had participated in this thread, if anything that I had written had hurted you.
I just tried to enrich us all, as I thank you all for having enriched me.

But the end is so happy…. Rasa Sayang is Indonesia’s.

It may not be the end, it even may be the beginning…
The beginning to us all to learn respecting other’s culture.

Good luck with the MTB campaign, I hope millions will visit Malaysia.
But if in the 1st place MTB did not use the song, maybe I also would come to Malaysia again.
But now I have lost my appetite to re-visit Malaysia (and so have many of Indonesians).
But don’t worry… I don’t say for all Indonesian people, just a little bit of them. And for sure, I speak for myself.

Peace for the both country.
Now I am trying to re-love Malaysia (though I know it’ll be very hard), just like the spirit of the song.

Rasa sayange…rasa sayang sayange…
Lihat Malaysia jauh rasa sayang-sayange…

Wassalamu’alaikum…

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well I was only 9 or so, but I still remember everything clearly. 🙂

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Kamarul, you really like this thread so much you don’t want have it end is it?

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Just to poke Tommy Joe (he he, heating up the discussion as Kamarul would like!) Stupid people says stupid things, so maybe he’s being stupid again. Ha ha ha ha!!

BTW, He says originated from Ambon! Ambon wasn’t an Indonesia state when the song spreaded. So, technically, he’s not contradicting his earlier claim, still stupid although! Kah Kah Kah

Aiya, Tommy Joe, why so like that (this phrase learnt from the Singaporean. Sue me!! :p )! If you dislike a country, you should come over and proves it!! Not like when people tells you A, u believes A! Come la, I treat you bak-kut-teh if u can eat pork.

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Ah sorry man rakan Tommy Joe, I just noticed your ending! So rude of me inviting u to pork. We go for Banana Leaf Rice from the Indians, it’s vegetarian, so no halal issue. OK OK?

(How can that greeting slipped my eye, so embarrassing!!)

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Dear Shamsul, LONG LIVE THE QUEEN!! Malaysia considered lucky to have a peaceful independence process. Anyway, the British still can’t stop minding their own business and always tries to interfere our Malaysian ways. They still have that above us kind of thinking. (Although they still are actually…. :p )

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Dear Bonar
I didn’t know. Sylar is Spock? That’s fun. He’s so adorable when he’s not munching people’s brain. Maybe he should learn from Spock, just do the V sign and touch people’s neck instead.

I haven’t even complete the part 2 of Heroes but have you check out the graphic novels of Heroes?

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@vic: graphic novel? yes2 i have, i have them printed in glossy photo paper, they are so rich in colors, made me droll…

so u havent finished season one part 2 yet? or were you talking about season 2? season 2 is a downer.

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